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Early Game Day Open Thread: Phoenix Suns at San Antonio Spurs

[Editor's Note: I am posting this early since I may not get a chance to do it tomorrow. Besides, a game like this really needs two days of discussion, right?]


Phoenix Suns
at

San Antonio Spurs
17-7 18-5
6:30 PM Mountain / 8:30 PM Eastern
TV: My45 HD, NBATV HighDef
Probable starters:
Steve Nash PG Tony Parker
Raja Bell SG Michael Finley
Grant Hill SF Bruce Bowen
Shawn Marion PF Tim Duncan
Amare Stoudemire C Fabricio Oberto

On Monday, the best road team in the West will take on the best home team in the West in a battle of last year's "should have been" champions (from the perspective of most Suns fans) versus the official champions. The Spurs have been dealing with injuries to Tim Duncan and Tony Parker of late. Duncan returned in Saturday's win over the Denver Nuggets, but Parker did not. Since I want to see both teams at full strength for this one, I'm going the "positive thinking" route in my projected starting lineups and including Parker, even though he is day-to-day. Despite the injuries, the Spurs have yet to lose at home this season, and are 13-0. The Suns are 10-4 on the road, good for tops in the West and second to Orlando (12-3) for the best road record overall.

I will be at this game, so jasonsuns1 will be live blogging in my place. The recap will be posted Tuesday evening.

Revenge wanted:

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Amare
This is his big test.  I've been all over this site saying he's maturing into a defender and passer.  If the guy ever gets there on defense, he's just going to be scary.  Duncan is back in the lineup, I here, and has had a game to get his legs back.  

I don't know if Parker is going to be ready to play (his ankle sounds really bad and the conservative move is to rest him -- not to mention the Victoria Secret's model thing).  That may make Duncan even more important.  Here's a challenge for STAT.

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 16, 2007 11:26 AM MST reply actions  

I can only hope
That STAT was thinking a little bit ahead last night and that he'll be super-motivated tomorrow night.

by SueB on Dec 16, 2007 12:12 PM MST up reply actions  

Line-up tweaks?
As satisfactory STAT is at the 5, it would be interesting to see if he was at PF and someone else like Marks or Skinner were playing the 5, at least for matchups like these.
By the way, good luck TexSUN at the game. Hope you don't get lauded too hard
If ya can't jump 'em out, then box 'em out!

by PurplePinoy on Dec 16, 2007 12:10 PM MST reply actions  

I couldn't agree more
In fact, I wrote about that here:

http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/story/2007/11/30/11584/006

You know, I think your use of the word "satisfactory" is right on the mark.

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 16, 2007 1:30 PM MST up reply actions  

Thanks for sharing the sentiment
but my only worry with such a line-up shift is that Marion will have to play the 3 where his athleticism can be negated. But I'll take that over having to double team Duncan, leaving the other two of the three headed monsters open, Parker and Ginobli.
If ya can't jump 'em out, then box 'em out!

by PurplePinoy on Dec 16, 2007 10:48 PM MST up reply actions  

Revenge!!!!!
The Count of Monte Cristo should be required reading for all the Suns.  As should V for Vendetta, or just any revenge theme book.  Not to mention that listening to lots of Heavy Metal should also get the Suns in the right mood to kick some ass tomorrow.

I truly hope we can instill some kind of uncertainty or fear into the hearts of the Sterns, their constant confidence is rather annoying.  This is the game were we must prove ourselves, if only to get our mojo going to stating winning some games again.  

"Ultimate excellence lies not in winning every battle, but in defeating your enemy without ever fighting." Sun Tzu

by Turambar on Dec 16, 2007 4:22 PM MST reply actions  

yep..
no question about it, this is the game I've been looking forward to since the season started. It'd be a nothing game if Duncan wasn't already back.

What a great chance to make a statement, (if you can ignore our losses to some very poor teams). I think the Suns are obviously a target for all teams, and these other teams get games throughout their season where they can rest some and not have to play 100%. Where the Suns don't get to play any games like this.

Anyways, in my opinion, the losses, some of it was just what hurt us last year against S.A in the playoffs, our incredible offense wasn't incredible at times. And you could say it was the spurs, but I don't think so. I think we just have a few games where we don't score 110+. Hopefully Hill will make the difference, but, I have to say, Diaw is what K.Thomas would've been, a player making 8-9 million who should be making 1-3 million.

One final comment on Amare, after watching the game against Utah, I can't praise him enough for his ability to catch some very quick and tough to handle passes. Amare has fantastic hands! Much of the hustle on defense (especially Marion) and so many other things during the Utah game, if I see the suns play like that, I feel pretty good about our chances!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 16, 2007 9:52 PM MST reply actions  

It comes down to the "other" guys
I still think the reason the Suns lost to the Spurs had less to do with Stern - sorry JSun - and more to do with the Suns' other guys not hitting open shots. The Suns offense is designed to create open looks and when even 1 of those guys is clicking is unstopable.

As we have seen in the past few games however, that when the Suns have to rely on Steve and Amare scoring big and Marion creating and making a last second shot then the Suns' aren't at their best.  

So, if for whatever reason Hill's, Bell's and LB's open looks that haven't been falling start falling then the Suns win.

If it comes down to Steve and Amare having to score 30 pts each then I don't like our chances.

Especially since Amare is nowhere near back to his low post scoring threat and appearantly Steve's back, neck and elbow (and tooth) have been effecting his shot.

I would have liked to have seen Nash and maybe even Amare benched for a few games to recover and give some minutes to other guys like Banks, Marks and DJ but Coach D feels that 50% Nash is still the best option. Likely true but also short-sighted.

by Seth Pollack on Dec 17, 2007 8:22 AM MST reply actions  

i AGREE,
I've been thinking this since last years playoffs, yes there were some bad calls, but if the suns other players scored and played close to their normal level, it would've been a different game! Look at those players (not nash or amare) stats for that series just for shooting, and the story agrees.

game 1 suns 106 spurs 111
only poor offensive night was by amare 6 for 19

game 2 suns 101 spurs 81
very strong offensive numbers for suns on shooting percentages

game 3 suns 101 spurs 108
nash 6 for 17
barbosa 2 for 6
nothing really horrible..

game 4 suns 104 spurs 98
barbosa 4 for 13

game 5 suns 85 spurs 88
barbosa 3 for 12
nash 6 for 19

game 6 suns 106 spurs 114
barbosa 5 for 15

I didn't post all players percentages because if their percentage was fair to good, I left it off. Basically, this confirms 2 things in my mind.

  1. Barbosa's offense was poor, which hurt us a lot
  2. For some of the games they put bowen or another very quick dirty player on Nash to mess Nash up, and it often worked
I'm starting to think that if the Suns coach had played a deeper bench, game 5 would've gone to the suns. I'll always think that this coach just misses the boat on the possibility of 1-2 more players being able to help given some playing time to develop. Dallas has lost a few games recently, but Bass (new player for them) has been learning, and their is little question in my mind, the mavs are thinking now about the playoffs and trying to get stronger now! The Suns are deeper this year than last, and I like that Hill is there as opposed to the silent James Jones, and Skinner is doing great!, so, for me the bench issue isn't quite the issue as it was last yr, but I'd still like to see DJ play.

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:59 AM MST up reply actions  

On Stern and Stoudemire
It's frustrating that he didn't allow the Suns to have a fair shot, but I'm not saying the Suns shouldn't have been able to overcome.  I mean, win Game 1 at home?  Anyway, my disgust is with the way Stern refuses to acknowledge he's there to serve the fans and not for his own personal aggrandizement.

I think Amare staying out of foul trouble on the defensive end is the key.  He needs to work early to establish his defensive presence.  If he does that, he avoids most of his desperation fouls.  I also hold out hope that Stoudemire and Skinner teaming together, at times, will relieve some of that pressure.

After that, Amare needs to grab more defensive boards.

If he can do those things, I love our chances because even if the "others" have a poor shooting night, the Suns are close and those guys can't miss all night.  If Amare does what he needs to do and those guys are hitting, it should be a run-away victory.

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 17, 2007 9:47 AM MST up reply actions  

Against the Bees
The supporting cast (Raja, LB, Hill) played pretty solidly. It was the 3 main guys (Amare, Marion, Nash) who had off nights. Now, if we could JUST get ALL of them to be "on" together, I think the Suns would be almost unstoppable. Hope it happens tonight!

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 1:21 PM MST reply actions  

The fans can win this one
Really the 6th man will determine the game tonight, the team is struggling but if they have the right support we can bag this one.

Also, I hope someone punches Robert Horry in the face tonight. Please Raja, please!

by emirem on Dec 17, 2007 4:17 PM MST reply actions  

But it is in San Antonio ...
so I hope the crowd is NOT a factor.

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 4:26 PM MST up reply actions  

You're right
I tak ethat back .. wrong game. This one is away, a tough game for us!

by emirem on Dec 17, 2007 4:34 PM MST up reply actions  

Just yell real loud
at the TV...oh, and TEXSUN will be there for us!

by Seth Pollack on Dec 17, 2007 4:39 PM MST up reply actions  

I yelled real loud at my TV last game..
It didn't seem to help. I'll definitely be yelling during this game as well, but hopefully I'll be yelling things such as YES! NICE! and WOOHOO! as opposed to #@*&%$!!!!!

by brian13 on Dec 17, 2007 4:44 PM MST up reply actions  

I guess
not enough people were yelling early in the game and so clearly the sixth man didn't show up for that NO game.

So come on people! We can do better! Let's see that fire and energy from the first tip! Let's show Coach D just how loud Phx fans can be!

by Seth Pollack on Dec 17, 2007 4:53 PM MST up reply actions  

People Like You Guys
Are why I can't watch games in bars ;)

Like it makes a difference?

I prefer to quietly seethe until it boils over into Postal Madness.

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 17, 2007 4:59 PM MST up reply actions  

One hour to go
This day has gone by so sloooowlly. Just need to fool my kids into going to bed half an hour earlier than usual tonight, so I can watch it live.  

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 5:30 PM MST reply actions  

ACOP is at it again
If anyone's interested in a little irreverant play by play, come visit me periodically during the game.

http://phan-x.blogspot.com/2007/12/suns-at-spurs.html

I wrote an introduction and everything for the uninitiated.

Yes, I am the smartest pesron in the room.

by Phan X on Dec 17, 2007 5:42 PM MST reply actions  

Signed up today
Might drop by. The more live blogs, the better.

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 5:48 PM MST up reply actions  

Oh, you're talking about pbp on your blog page
Not the ACOP message board thread (which is what I signed up for). So .... three places to read other people's thoughts. I may not have time to watch the game ... ;)

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 5:53 PM MST up reply actions  

Yessum!
If you miss the game, you'll be able to relive the whole thing, now!

Hopefully they give me something worth writing.  

OFF TO LOG WITH A B LIKE SUE!!!

Yes, I am the smartest pesron in the room.

by Phan X on Dec 17, 2007 6:02 PM MST up reply actions  

hey phan X
loved this comment
I liked him a lot better when he was on "Perfect Strangers."

haha, I'll definitely be checking in and hopefully get a login soon

good job on site!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:38 PM MST up reply actions  

That video
Gets me all riled up!!!!!

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, I am the smartest pesron in the room.

by Phan X on Dec 17, 2007 6:01 PM MST reply actions  

Nice
Suns announcing team being used on NBA TV. I wasn't expecting that.

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 6:40 PM MST reply actions  

when looking
at the starting 5 of each team, the suns look so strong!!

Someone who tends to get overlooked, who in my eyes is an all star level player (at times) is finley for the spurs.

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:41 PM MST reply actions  

nice pass from nash to marion
looks like the suns have come to play!!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:44 PM MST reply actions  

wow
duncan is so consistent, good offensive board by marion, an another offensive board, an amare, yes!!!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:46 PM MST reply actions  

good game so far
Ginobili and Duncan are playing great, as expected. Nice to see hill doing well!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:50 PM MST reply actions  

Hill's looking good
Creating shots and hitting them.

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 6:51 PM MST reply actions  

i just love
that Hill was defensive player of the year in college, nice to have him!!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:52 PM MST up reply actions  

sure is nice to be watching this one
TexSun is out there in the stands somewhere...as I'm
sure you all know

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:51 PM MST reply actions  

marjlee makes a good point
spurs hitting layups, suns shooting jumpers right now

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:56 PM MST reply actions  

nice ugly three by marion!!
Caused by Diaw driving to hoop and creating space for Marion, diaw is doing it tonight (so far!)

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 6:57 PM MST reply actions  

So far, so good
What a huge difference when Duncan isn't in there. I wish he'd stay out. ;)

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 6:57 PM MST reply actions  

just saw an add for the suns
talking about suns players and community, marion giving fundamental pointers to people, hopefuly not on shooting form

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:01 PM MST reply actions  

get skinner in there
and really play physical with duncan

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:02 PM MST reply actions  

good hustle
at end of first
suns 26 spurs 20

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:05 PM MST reply actions  

just wish
Raja's 3 had gone in. At least horry's was too late.

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 7:10 PM MST up reply actions  

early so far, going well
sure wish parker was in there, suns playing well, Diaw is playing great

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:10 PM MST reply actions  

diaw
should've shot on that one

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:11 PM MST reply actions  

spurs catching up
and skinner scores!!

39 - 33 suns winning

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:17 PM MST reply actions  

spurs within 2
Nash had time to slow down for that three, it was obvious his body moving forward hurt his shot, skinner!! YES

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:25 PM MST reply actions  

duncan
20 points 10 rebounds!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:26 PM MST reply actions  

nash gets run over a little
Horry does what he didn't do last yr and holds nash up

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 7:59 PM MST reply actions  

technical foul on Horry
and nash drops the free throw
59 - 57 suns winning

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:03 PM MST reply actions  

59 all
If the Spurs win, it will be because of Duncan, he has been fantastic for them. We're doing good, but we're missing a lot of chances, Bell has missed a lot of threes (wide open) if he was even 1 for 2 I'd be ok, but he is 1 for 5 STOP SHOOTING BELL!!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:06 PM MST reply actions  

NASH ALSO
is having an off game scoring wise, 1 for 5

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:07 PM MST reply actions  

sure needed that
a three by nash!!

and a bucket and one for barbosa, great run!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:11 PM MST reply actions  

ok
seriously 1 - 6 Bell misses another 3

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:13 PM MST reply actions  

tied up a 65
ok, I just looked at Bells 3 pt shooting during all the games this yr, he has had many fair to good games, its just we can't have a game like this from him when it matters so much!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:15 PM MST reply actions  

great defense by skinner
on duncan

and barbosa for 2! Great move! suns by 1

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:28 PM MST reply actions  

barbosa for three!!
we sure needed that

suns up by 2 and a stop

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:35 PM MST reply actions  

uh
horrible air ball by barbosa

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:36 PM MST reply actions  

yes
Score for Amare, we should be getting it to amare much more,

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:37 PM MST reply actions  

3:20 to go, suns down by 1
Suns just not scoring like they were earlier at the end of the third! Spurs are looking like the three point scoring team that we need (and normally are) to be!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:38 PM MST reply actions  

marion just doesn't do much against the spurs
scoring wise

probably because we can't run against them...

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:39 PM MST reply actions  

nice drive and pass from nash to amare
thought amare had the dunk, got the foul on duncan

don't recognize duncan not complaining about a call

tie game

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:41 PM MST reply actions  

nice to see us trying
hard on defense, too bad we tend to do it in spurts, instead of consistently, probably has something to do with energy, spend so much on offense, have only a certain amount left for d

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:43 PM MST reply actions  

wow!!
great sequence, amare pokes ball away, matrix chases it down, and Hill scores on 15footer!!

suns by 1, 39 seconds left

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:49 PM MST reply actions  

great game
not our best shooting, but, it would be sweet to break s.a.'s 13-0 home streak this yr

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:50 PM MST reply actions  

poor call by ref
should've had the continue on amare

down by 1

amare at line

tie game

17 seconds left

and amare makes both!!

suns by 1

s.a. timeout

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:52 PM MST reply actions  

skinner in for amare
yes...9.9 to go, suns winning and at the line

bowen just misses his three

and hill at the line

nails his first

2 pt lead...1 more

3 pt lead, 9 seconds left, spurs ball. Hill is our savior!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:55 PM MST reply actions  

wow
I bet TexSun is having fun there

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:56 PM MST reply actions  

yes,
boris steals it from Balki, I mean Ginoboli

yes!! 2 free throws and the ball

It's all but over...wait, boris blows first free throw, and makes second, 4 pt lead and ball
6 sec left

have to like it

smartly, ball gets to nash, I'm calling it, suns beat spurs alright!! great Game

suns now up by 5

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 8:59 PM MST reply actions  

down go the spurs!!!!!!!
I have to say, we didn't play our A game, but still won, I'd like to think if we play our A game, we could win by 10+!!

Great game, no question Hill player of the game!

by jasonsuns1 on Dec 17, 2007 9:00 PM MST reply actions  

Excellent victory!
Great team play by the Suns, winning despite Duncan's huge game. I know the Spurs didn't have Parker, but still. Had to have it. I'm so happy!

by SueB on Dec 17, 2007 9:05 PM MST reply actions  

YESSSS!
Oh man this feels too good!!!!
It was just soo freakin beautiful to see them attack the basket the way they did, Phoenix Suns style (using fast ball movement and slashes to the basket). See that world! Speed and accuracy still kills at the half court! Oh and can we give big kudos to the defense (especially Hill's sweet block on Duncan). One TX team down, another one to go, BRING ON HASSELHOFF AND THE MAVS!
If ya can't jump 'em out, then box 'em out!

by PurplePinoy on Dec 17, 2007 9:11 PM MST reply actions  

8 blocks 8steals
For the suns.  And 17 to zip fastbreAk points

by Seth Pollack on Dec 17, 2007 9:16 PM MST reply actions  

What a Difference
A Boris Diaw sighting.

Average D from Stoudemire, including a gutsy deflection on TD in the post while holding onto 5 fouls.

Excellent D from Skinner.

Grant Hill back to looking like a Piston.

Clutch free throw shooting.

Defensive adjustments on TD.

Bowen getting called for hacking while defending Nash on the perimeter.

A couple of times, they switched Nash on screens early on the shot clock; Bowen's the only guy who's got a chance to defend the pick-and-roll, so I'd like to see even more of this.

On to the most disappointing team in the league.

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 17, 2007 9:23 PM MST reply actions  

G Hill
I really believe that this is the Grant Hill we will see in the playoffs, and he will be able to take up any slack if Marion or Stoudemire drop off.  Also, his defense was great too, gettin steals and blocks all over the place.  I think we're starting to get a gameplan for beating SA, albeit they were without TP tonight.  

by SilverSprings on Dec 17, 2007 9:24 PM MST reply actions  

Without Nash
How about the run at the end of the 3rd?  They stumbled a little in the fourth, but no self-destruction w/o Nash this time.
Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 17, 2007 9:51 PM MST up reply actions  

from AT&T Center
I've never been to an NBA game before tonight. I broke my cherry on the Suns and the Spurs at AT&T Center. Surrounded by Spurs fans.

And, oh, it was sweet.

Some notes:

  1. You know how the Spurs complain and look flabbergasted whenever a foul is called on them? Okay, now imagine an arena doing it,every single time there's any contact. You just imagined the AT&T Center.
  2. Tim Duncan. Wow. Jesus. It's not just the grace the skill, the numbers. It's the confidence and control he has. He gets it in the block and you absolutely know what's going to happen and you're powerless against it.
  3. Grant Hill. I questioned whether Hill was enough to help this season when he was signed. Tonight, he did all the stuff everyone expected, hit jumpers, create opportunities, provide tremendous leadership in clutch situations. But he also played incredible defense on Ginobli. It was pure revenge for the Bowen treatment on Nash (which was also in full effect tonight).
  4. Suck it, Spurs.
Also, Boris Diaw has a pulse.

by Ridiculous Matt on Dec 17, 2007 11:13 PM MST reply actions  

Amen brother
Amen fellow Suns fan.  Those scum sucking Spurs fans shall know fear yet!!!!
"Ultimate excellence lies not in winning every battle, but in defeating your enemy without ever fighting." Sun Tzu

by Turambar on Dec 17, 2007 11:35 PM MST up reply actions  

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