Lakers trounce Phoenix - Suns don't measure up

by Phoenix Stan on Nov 21, 2008 9:45 AM MST Comment 16 comments

Terry Porter called this game a measuring stick to see where his team was at this point in the season. It's pretty clear that against top competition we don't measure up.

The best news about this game is that it's over.

What we saw tonight was a huge gap between two teams moving in the same direction at different speeds.

The Lakers came back from the improvements they made last year and added a healthy Bynum and under appreciated Ariza. They've upgraded some key positions and are playing with a ton of confidence. They aren't forced to rely on Luke Walton which is a net plus in anyone's book.

On top of that they've brought a defensive intensity that the Suns still lack. Phil Jackson's triangle offense is well ingrained in this group of players which let's him focus defensively while Porter is still fighting with his team to figure out who they are going to be.

We are still seeing a lot of Suns standing around waiting for Shaq to score 30. We see guys watching the ball and then if it comes thier way jacking up bad shots. And finally, we are seeing guys miss the open looks they are getting.

Tonight we saw a Suns team that knew they couldn't win and they played like it.

The good news is that you measure things so you know how far you've come and how far you have to go. I am still confident that this group of Suns players will improve under this system and find a rhythm that works.

The problem of course is that while the Suns are a good team getting better, the Lakers are a better team getting great. Unless the injury bug slows them down, it's hard to see how we will.

Forum Blue and Gold * Post Game Quotes * Box Score * EV Trib Recap

And please God, let this be the last time we have to hear about the Shaq Kobe Phil love/hate triangle.

We really don't care anymore.

Amen.

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Comments

you said it. They are an awesome scary team no question

Window Closed? Shit, just break it then.

by ZonaFlash on Nov 20, 2008 11:33 PM MST reply actions 0 recs

They are scary.

We had a bad game. I saw the highlights, not pretty to watch, and my bartender friend at the pub I go to ( a Suns fan ) and I were upset. But we must move on. It is one game against them. We have them again.

by CanadianBlazerfan on Nov 21, 2008 7:43 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs

I find it sad

That shaq has become the most important piece for your offense. That should never happen anymore.

Shaq:"The kobster, he's an assassin" Answer for who should be mvp.

by ldeep on Nov 20, 2008 11:36 PM MST reply actions 0 recs

we're sad about that too.

Window Closed? Shit, just break it then.

by ZonaFlash on Nov 20, 2008 11:42 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs

i mean sure, shaq is playing like it’s still 1999, but dang it! this just shouldn’t happen… the offense is so confusing now

I'm just like you, only ten times better.

by noonoo on Nov 20, 2008 11:53 PM MST reply actions 0 recs

ridiculous

if you want to slow the game down then fine, i will accept that as a premise towards offensive development. BUT then why in the hell do you do a great job getting in the penalty with 7 minutes to go in the third quarter, and then not shoot a single free throw the rest of the quarter!!! I mean, the Suns are playing like idiots. Steve Nash, particularly, is playing like an idiot. They’re down, they’re in the penalty, POUND the ball inside to either Shaq (who was playing much better than Bynum) or to Amare (who at times was much better than Gasol). It’s those things that make me so frustrated, realizing that the team has already given up on this year and their new coach.

by ArizonaCactus on Nov 21, 2008 12:22 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

No post offense

I’ll tell you what the problem with the Suns this year is (as many here already know): they are playing a post-centric offense with only one player on the roster who can play in the post (Shaq), and he’s wildly inconsistent due to his age and/or conditioning. Things run OK or even well when Shaq is in the game and he’s on, but if he’s not then the team is wildly out of sync in trying to run a traditional inside-out offense with guys who can’t play on the inside.

For all the hype Amare gets that guy absolutely NEEDS a post game! If he’s not going to learn how to play in the post at all, then he needs to shift to small forward and the Suns need to get a PF, even if it’s just a stopgap kind of guy like Kurt Thomas was. Even a finesse guy who is widely considered to be marshmallow soft like Pau Gasol has a post game! Amare likes to set up 20 feet from the rim so he can either shoot Js or get a running start at a thunder dunk, and that’s great and all, but the team needs him to also be able to set up on the low block and get a jump hook or a drop step up when Shaq is either resting on the bench or hasn’t made it down court yet.

Boris needs to follow this same advice, and TP needs to start giving Lopez more looks too, even if it’s just a couple minutes in the 2nd quarter. The rotations tonight were bizarre to say the least. Shaq starting the 2nd quarter? Lots of work to be done here.

by WildYams on Nov 21, 2008 12:30 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

i don't think

that a shaq-centric offense is such a bad thing, although it makes me extremely uncomfortable. shaq was getting a lot of good touches off of nash’s lob passes and able to finish, resulting in a lot of points. i don’t think that’s gonna go away for the suns.

what i didnt like was how the rest of the team didnt play as hard as shaq did (i find it so bizarre i’m defending this guy) with the exception of boris, who was looking for his shot in the post while getting people involved too. everybody else seemed content to stick up mid-range jumpers (hill, amare, nash) despite fastbreak numbers, despite lakers in foul trouble/penalty. raja and barnes couldnt get their threes to fall.

amare settled for shots just inside the arc. it’s part of his game but it shouldnt be his go-to move, because he does his best damage with and-1’s, getting people in foul trouble. he was bothered by the lakers’ inside defense. his shots were falling for a bit in the 2nd quarter, where the suns were most aggressive, and he was content to shoot for the rest of the game, hence 8 for 23. as much as i love them, he nor nash sure didnt look like mvps.

by phxsun on Nov 21, 2008 3:35 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, shaq was the bright spot tonight.

I was thinking about past teams. Think how boring the barkley offense was. Watching him back his fat ass down to the post for 20 seconds and the turnaround fall-away shot or if doubled the pass to the shooter or cutter.

Then there was the KJ offense, which was clear out, drive and dish. We were really spoiled with the crazy dantoni nash offense.

Window Closed? Shit, just break it then.

by ZonaFlash on Nov 21, 2008 4:05 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs

Team is all over the place

No one seems in sync, looks like preseason. I do think, even though last night would not of made a difference, Suns miss LB, they miss that offense. Nash looks confused and pissed.
But this was the Lakers, by far the best team in the league, I think they post a 66-16 record.

"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"

by Grockcubs on Nov 21, 2008 6:35 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

Depressing

I’m still waiting for the Suns to find out just who they are. I know we need patience but it’s tough when you see games like last night when you see flashes of what could be…..and then it all falls into disarray.

Wait wait wait. We still have to wait.

"Yeah I could have been king, but maybe I already am king. Hail to the king baby." Ash from Army of Darkness

by Turambar on Nov 21, 2008 7:20 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

comes a trade and the usual cliches……fit in, adjust, same page yadda yadda

by cornvillian on Nov 21, 2008 7:33 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

Shaq turnovers

I only saw about half of the game, but it looked to me as if Shaq had cinder blocks for hands. Then when I checked the box score this morning, I saw that he had four turnovers…twice as many as Nash. Shaq also shot only 50 percent. That’s a great percentage if you’re a two-guard, but not if you’re shooting five feet from the rim.

Let me just throw out a couple of potentially stupid ideas. Here’s the first: don’t have Nash and Shaq on the court at the same time. When you want to run a creative, up-tempo offense, let Nash play and make Shaq sit. When you want to slow it down and dump it into the post, let Shaq play and make Nash sit. Then both can do what they do best (assuming Shaq can hit his easy shots). Here’s the second idea: move Nash to two-guard. He’s a great shooter, so let him catch and shoot. Or let him catch and dish. Either way, I like the idea of a more consistent offensive threat at the two-guard position, and I like the idea of getting maximum value out of Nash under Porter, which I don’t think we’re getting now.

by beatcal on Nov 21, 2008 8:24 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

Leadership

Where’s the leadership on this team? I really think it has to come from the top. Jerry was the leader. He set the attitude. Sarver is clueless, he picked a longtime friend in Sarver that is clueless, and Kerr couldn’t get along with Mike, so Mike left, and then we got Porter, who seems to be clueless. I told a suffering Mavs fan friend of mine that Porter seems to be like Avery Johnson without the high pitched voice and yelling. They are both so stubborn.

Lets face it, we blew it by not picking Paul Silas. We need a tough coach who can motivate people like Nash, Shaq, Bell, and Amare whilst encouraging new guys like Lopez, Dragic, LB, and Boris. Porter is pissing off the veterans, and the new guys don’t know their role.

I am convinced we should have traded LB and Boris the day D’Antoni was hired in NY. That was the point of their highest value.

Bottom line – I said it before. No way Nash comes back with Porter here. When Nash and Shaq leave, Amare will have no reason to stay, and we become the LA Clippers until Sarver sells.

April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?

by Hawk42 on Nov 21, 2008 10:10 AM MST reply actions 0 recs

The offense is painful to watch

I wasn’t really expecting the Suns to get a win last night, but the manner in which that loss was served up was hideous.

Ernie Johnson put it pretty well at halftime: “The Suns were the most fun team to watch in the NBA, and now they are absolutely not that anymore.” They are so clearly not all on the same page offensively. Shaq is (for the most part) playing so much better than I think any Suns fan could have hoped for, but we have pretty much lost Steve Nash. Some of it is Shaq taking up so much space under the basket, but Porter’s schemes are not utilizing the Nash rambler’s unique talents. He’s been reduced to bringing the ball up and feeding the postzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz ooops, I nodded off there, flashing back to that offensive display last night.

Oy.

by SoCalSun on Nov 21, 2008 12:07 PM MST reply actions 0 recs