The Nash Dilema

by Phoenix Stan on Nov 23, 2008 11:36 AM MST

Here's my question to all you smart people out there. In watching Saint Nash this season we've all observed a troubling trend. Turnovers. He had 8 last night against the Blazers.

I don't think anyone is particularly worried about a decline in points or assists. That was expected with less playing time and an offense that didn't rely on Steve's creative abilities 70% of the time. And no, that number has no basis in statistical reality. It's pure anecdotal SWAGery.

What is more puzzling is MVP Steve demonstrating his usual ability to make the difficult look easy while at the same time making the seemingly easy look difficult.

We still see the pick and roll run to near perfection. We still see great shooting percentages and a knack for hitting timely big shots. And we still see at least the occasional glimpses of fast break brilliance.

What we don't see is something you would expect from most second string point guards. We don't see crisp perimeter passing. We don't see smart and well executed post entry passing. We don't see good decision making in the half court game.

To be fair, the numbers show that Nash's 36 minute adjusted rate of 3.8 this season is consistent with the past few years. And not surprising given his job, he leads the team with 46 overall (4th in the league) which is 10 more then Amare and 15 more then Shaq.

So the numbers aren't horrible but with fewer overall possessions the impact of each one is magnified and instead of coming on failed attempts at brilliant plays they are coming on seemingly simple basketball maneuvers.

Some people agree with this theory that the system is at fault and forcing Nash to play this way is like watching a "hummingbird trapped inside a sandwich bag".

My problem with that is this. Shouldn't one of the "greatest point guards of all time" be able to adapt his game to a more traditional possession oriented efficient offense? Would Magic still be great if he could only run?

I am the last person likely to pull the rip cord and call the Porter Experiment a failure. I preach patience and chill. I like what the Suns are trying to do and I do think it will work itself out given a bit more time.

But I wonder my friends what you think is behind this very early season, small sample size loaded with distractions trend.

Speak now and let your voices ring true.

(if you havn't noticed I have been in a strangly poetic frame of mind since Nov 4th)

Poll

What is behind Nash's making the easy look difficult and the difficult look easy?

Change takes time. We are all creatures of habit. More change management please

60 votes

Age catches up to everyone eventually

30 votes

Don't blame Nash if his team mates can't find the open spot and catch a pass

22 votes

Shaq. His large post presense is the root of all evil

32 votes

Why are you asking me? I live in a basement.

10 votes

154 votes | Poll has closed

1 recs | Comment 9 comments |

Read Related

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

He has made some pretty bad passes

We’re still getting the usual forced passes in the pick and roll. It’s really weird though, guys are picking his passes right out of the air in front of him. You think he’d see it coming but he does it every game now. He isn’t getting much help from the team though, it’s like they expect him to be able to make every pass no matter how bad their position.

I’m sure a lot of it is not being used to playing out of his element, but he should be able to adjust.

by hcblankscreen on Nov 23, 2008 1:13 PM MST 0 recs

He's forcing a lot.

But I do think it’s a combination of the new system AND Shaq. Steve’s at his best when he can probe the lane, and Shaq clogs that up a bit. This new offense calls for Steve to play off the ball more, and he’s not used to that. I also disagree about his prowess for PnRs; he’s made some shockingly bad reads on what used to be his bread and butter play, and that’s simply because he’s out of practice.

I’m fully confident that he’ll find his rhythm, but it may take some time.

by rsavaj on Nov 23, 2008 1:27 PM MST 0 recs

My thoughts

From a pg perspective, it’s so much easier to do your job when you know what type of team you are. If you are a running team, you know to puch the ball and have no hesitations doing it. If you’re a set offense team, you know to slow it down, set it up/reset, and control the offense.

I think what we are seeing is an indecisive Nash (and team, for that matter). He’s not someone who isn’t going to do what the coach wants.

I think he’s just a bit unsure of what the identity is and the answer isn’t necessarily an easy one. And rsavaj is right, so much of it is about rythym and I think we can all agree that the Suns haven’t found a consistent one this year.

I think we are getting there though..

It's Ba-Nash. It's a no brainer.

by Suns Ben on Nov 23, 2008 2:49 PM MST 0 recs

Idle Hands are the Devil's Plaything

Maybe he’s just bored to death.

How is neutralizing the greatest qualities of a future Hall of Fame PG a good idea?

This is the biggest waste of Steve Nash’s twilight years that I can imagine. You could just switch him out with anonymous NBA PG now, and get the same results.

Trade him to New York. I think there’s a guy up there who knows something about utilizing Steve Nash. I bet Terry Porter would love Chris Duhon. Why in god’s name would you want one of the most creative floor leaders in NBA history to adjust to being just like every other crappy NBA PG who feeds the post and gets out of the way. How is this the key to a championship?

I do not like what the Suns are trying to do. I think that the Shaq trade was an awful mistake and that you’re all trying to convince yourselves otherwise, that this new ‘regime’ is somehow going to work out better. I think you all need to put down the glass of kool aid and see this for what it is.

Terry Porter is not the answer. Never was. This is a sad pathetic joke.

by truth32 on Nov 23, 2008 9:12 PM MST 0 recs

Come on

No matter how bad you make the individual numbers look, the team sucks so much more with him off the court. Sure Nash looks shaky individually, but he’s just getting into the season and the play with him on the floor is still pretty good.

Aren’t we tied for second in the west at this early stage? That’s pretty good considering that the team (TP included) is still trying to see what works.

Window Closed? Shit, just break it then.

by ZonaFlash on Nov 24, 2008 12:20 AM MST 0 recs

half-empty, half-full, I'm looking for the whole glass...

The defense is (seems?) better, and Shaq is playing pretty well, you knew he was going to come out on a mission to destroy Oden, and it’s a good sign that he was able to deliver—he made Andrew Bynum look pretty bad as well, the rest of the Laker game notwithstanding. On the other hand, the offense continues to err, offend, and the turnovers are turrible. Nash is a wizard, but he does (and has) make some awfully lazy passes. With fewer possessions in the game those are a bit more costly. It’s early on, and there are only 3 teams in the league with more wins than the Suns, but I would like to see a little more flow out there—the Suns continue to look their best when they’re running, and in the games where they look so bad, there is, surprise, surprise, no running going on—I think there were ZERO fast break points against the Lakers?

by SoCalSun on Nov 24, 2008 12:31 PM MST up 0 recs

i actually dont think he is " one of the greatest point guards of all time"

i think to be specifically accurate, you could say he has had “3 of the greatest point guard seasons of all time”

nash is clearly a better run and gun style PG than anything else. and when playing in a system which dantoni deserves so much credit for, it maximised every ounce of nashs talents while completely minimizing his deficiencies. I think nash is one of the greatest ever suns players, but i dont think he is an all time great PG. I think he had some awesome seasons in a system which suited him and for that he became unstoppable. But what we are seeing now is exactly why is is great, but just not “all time great” -because he isnt as effective in a traditional system.

i do put alot of the turnovers down to throwing passes to guys who arent there yet – knowing nash – he is probably passing them to where people are meant to be and they are teh ones not knowing the offense properly?? (clutching at straws here) but what i can say is that he is still clutch, still awesome, and when he works out where it is going wrong and adjusts accordingly, then the second half of this season could be looking very bright!

by SDU on Nov 24, 2008 4:36 AM MST 0 recs

Here's my take

His first instinct is to run. When he realizes there’s no one to pass the ball to, he stops and walks the ball. All of this happens in a matter of seconds and it might look like it’s not a big deal but it really messes with the PG’s. It comes back to what Ben said: we are looking at an indecisive Nash. Not knowing when to run or slow down seems to be his problem. But hopefully it will work itself out.

If I were him, I would spend more time reviewing tapes and plays. Studying them, and I would clarify with Porter (and the team) When to run so we are all on the same page.

"Basketball doesn't build character. It reveals it"

by PanamaSun on Nov 24, 2008 2:59 PM MST 0 recs