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Suns fans giving up already?

Wow Suns fans. Reading the comments and listening to the local sports talk radio one would think our team started the season as favorites to win it all and suddenly and unexpectedly fell apart. All the negativity has me confused.

Where exactly do fans think this team should be by now? We are a 6 or 7 seed in the West and that's exactly how we look. I am sorry if your hopes are being dashed but that's where this team ended last year and that's where this team started this year.

There's a good chance we will improve as the season progresses and if we get lucky on the injury front we might not get bounced in the first round. Until then, I find it much more enjoyable to watch for signs of improvement as the season progresses then dwell on the mistakes of the past. Especially as long as The Big Mistake is playing so well.

Shaq isn't going anywhere and if he wasn't playing better then Amare then this wouldn't be "his team" right now. Nash is not going to get younger and suddenly be able to play like it's 2006 again. Boris Diaw is not going to be an all-star. But together this group has a lot of talent and with enough time might just be decent.  Or, they may never figure it out and ego's and dissent might tear the team apart before they ever get a chance. I am a homer and will at least give them time to fail before calling it quits and calling for a coaching change or a trade or a new GM.

 

 

Star-divide

Yes, it blows getting smoked by a Heat team that was on fire after getting embarrassed by the Blazers. Having our MVP wannabe go MIA isn't much fun to watch. Seeing former all NBA defensive player get abused like a school yard nerd calling for less recess is disheartening to say the least.

But did you really think this team with a new coach preaching defense for the first time in years and trying to deepen the rotation beyond seven would be better by now?

There's no question that the Suns need to improve. They know it. We know it. If the playoff's started in December we would be through.

Fortunately, the playoffs don't start in December. The plan for this year has ALWAYS been to learn on the fly how to play team defense and at least two styles of offense all the while incorporating rookies and new players into a deeper rotation. There is no way that it was going to look great by December.

Let's not forget that the player who's individually stunk the worst night in and night out is one-trick Raja who unless he's spotting up for a three is useless on both ends of the floor. It doesn't help that we've been the thinnest at this position  with Tucker still on the shelf and LB barely having a chance to play at all. Having no depth behind our worst starter is not something you can exactly coach around with an adjustment.

Speaking of adjustments, I've noticed some critique of Porter on this front.

Did anyone else notice that after three blown entry passes against the Heat's fronting defense Porter called a time out and low and behold there was adjustments. The ball rotated strong to weak or strong to the high arc where Shaq sealed his man for an entry pass. Those passes that no longer were attempted by Sean the Rookie but instead were coming in from Grant Hill, the team's second best distributor. This reminds me of a few years ago when the zone would stifle D'Antoni's vaunted offense. It took a bit of time but the Suns learned how to play through that and they will learn how to play against this type of defense as well.

Other adjustments:

Instead of leaving Raja (our alleged defensive stopper) to continue to get thrashed by Wade, Porter "hide him" on Marion and let Hill or Barnes try and slow Flash.

Has anyone else noticed Shaq coming out of the lane to trap ball handlers for this first time ever in a Suns uniform?

Are you seeing Amare get the ball in the low post or Shaq clearing out so LB can drive?

I don't agree with every move Porter makes but I do think his honeymoon period should probably extend beyond one month of play and a .647 record.

Sure, the Suns have only beaten one good team but I seem to recall the same thing in previous years. Remember going 0-4 against the Hornets and 1-3 against the Lakers last year? Of course, I also remember going 3-1 against the Spurs during the regular season that didn't matter much come spring time either.

I am getting tired of preaching patience (get it?) but that's exactly what's needed. Even after an poor showing at home on national TV. We got beat by a Heat time that was seriously pissed and a couple of our guys didn't show up ready to play.

We've seen this before from Amare and we've also see him get his act together and go on an extended tear. I hope we see that soon. There's not much this team is going to do without him but in the mean time there's a lot the team can do to get better.

 

 

 

 

Poll
Are you giving up on the Suns already?
The Suns will be lucky to make the playoffs let alone win a series
36 votes
Ask me again in a two months
48 votes
I bleed orange and purple no matter how bad they play
67 votes

151 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs  |  Comment 17 comments

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Comments

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3 problems

The turnovers, Raja Bell and the continued failure to develop a backup PG. Once they figure those out, I’m out of panic mode. However, I’m pessimistic that the turnover problem will get fixed this year. You’re right about the in-game adjustments by Porter, but it would sure be nice if All-Stars could figure this out on their own. I’ve also seen more of Shaq getting the hell out of the lane on offense when necessary.

If Bell would just do like Bruce Bowen (defend mercilessly and spot up for 3s), then I’d have no problem with him as a starter. If memory serves, didn’t LB have outstanding numbers as a starter last year? Given that neither Bell nor LB are playing good D, I’d just as soon have a true shooter and finisher starting in the 2-spot.

As to #3, I’m just perplexed. TP’s using depth at every other position, so why does he continue to stick two 2-guards in the backcourt when Nash is out? Develop the backup PG and let it be a painful process. If the Suns have that for the postseason, I’d be a lot less concerned. They don’t seem to be getting there.

Seems to me that 2 of these 3 problems could be solved. If so, this 6 or 7 seed is looking more like a 3 or 4 seed.

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Nov 29, 2008 8:15 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Turnovers

I am willing to bet that turnovers will be at or below league average my January.

We agree on Bell. Finally. You’ve been well ahead of me on this one. LB’s D is improving. Bell’s devolving. Can’t wait for Tucker to be part of the mix.

Backup PG. I think this will be tough for either rookie to really develop to much this year unless Nash is out for an extended period. The flip side is if Nash can stay healthy and rested we can get by in the playoffs with limited minutes from either rook plus a combo of LB, Hill and Barnes. I am less worried about this for this season.

Although – I have been thinking about Sergio Rodriquez wanting out of Portland. He would be great backing up Steve. Would they take Bell for Sergio and Outlaw? They really don’t have depth at the 2 guard that is tradeable. Rudy and Bayless aren’t going anywhere and don’t make enough $ anyway. Maybe a 3rd team to get us a back up 2 instead of Outlaw? Ideas?

by Phoenix Stan on Nov 29, 2008 8:58 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

More on backup PG

I think Singletary will have a long career as an above-average PG in the league. He’ll probably bounce through a few teams.

This year, Singletary is the #2 PG. I don’t, however, ever see him being an effective starting PG. Right now, he’s too short and not very stout. Finishing the drive is a problem, finding an open teammate on a kick-out is a problem. HIs shooting is good and improving. His heart and decision-making seems to be where it should be for a rookie. I believe he’s limited, though, and won’t be a starter.

Dragic has more upside, due to his size, his defense and his vision. He’s got the vision, just not the huevos right now. Don’t know if he’ll get there.

Any trade that gets Bell out of here is good in my books. If I were Portland, though, I don’t know if I’d want Bad Attitude Bell backing up Roy. Would you give up Outlaw for that?

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Nov 30, 2008 10:00 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Not giving up

Stan, I am not giving up. But I do not see any progress. Bell, LB, and Diaw should have gone with D’Antoni. Hey, if Mike didn’t have to save money for LeBron, I wouldn’t be surprised to see Shawn and Steve eventually in New York. He has done great with Q.

I think these players can only reach their best playing in an up-tempo system.

Where is your expectation of future progress?

April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?

by Hawk42 on Nov 29, 2008 9:59 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Great question

Here’s the improvements I have seen so far this year:

1) Offensive efficiency – So maybe not an improvement but we are still #1 in the NBA and plus 50% FG. Not too bad for all the troubles
2) Defense shooting % – at 44% we are #9. Defense in general is much better and improving
3) Rebounding – We are # 9 in opp rebounds and were #2 before that crap game against Minnie. We were also in the top 10 in Reb dif until recently. That’s a lot better
4) Toughness – The Suns are no longer pushovers
5) LB and Diaw – both guys are better this year then under D’Antoni. Diaw especially. LB looks much better on D but of course he’s not played much yet
6) Depth and rotations – no where to go but up after the last regime

by Phoenix Stan on Nov 30, 2008 9:00 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Didn't answer your question

Expectations for future progress:

1) Turnovers. Obviously. If we can cut down on giving up easy points the game will be much easier. This mainly is about Nash learning the system and the guys getting on the same page instead of each one trying to win the game himself.
2) Defense. The rotations aren’t there yet but I think this just takes time to learn what Porter wants
3) Rotations. There’s not been enough time yet to have the variety of rotations playing well together. Its easy when 7 or 8 guys play every night. What Porter is trying to do is much harder but it will get better and it will pay off
4) Amare. Amare of course needs to get his head right and play better on both ends. We know he can do it and like I said, we’ve seen these mini-slumps before and he’s always bounced back.
5) Shooting guard rotation. More LB and Tucker. Less Bell. At this point I would consider trading Bell for the right deal. I think he’s been horrible and my gut says he’s a disruption in the locker room too.

by Phoenix Stan on Nov 30, 2008 9:06 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Stand back...I can explain the whole thing

It’s only fun to watch your NBA team when: a) they’re a title contender; b) they’re not a title contender, but they’re playing much better than expected (e.g., Golden State a couple of years ago); or c) they’re not a title contender, they’re not playing much better than expected, but you can see that they’re on their way to becoming a title contender, or at least on their way to playing much better than expected.

The Suns right now are none of the above, and appear to be on a downward slope rather than an upward one. So, what is there to feel good/be happy about?

by beatcal on Nov 29, 2008 10:33 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

There can be only one

Every year, there is only one team that will win the championship. The rest of the teams are just wasting their time.

This must be how the Grizzlies fans feel every year knowing they have no shot to do anything in the playoffs (if they even make it)

by eagleheart on Nov 30, 2008 3:19 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

B

I think we are B. Remember that the Suns ended the season as the 6 seed and were bounced in the first round. Improvement is doing better then that and we are and I think are on track to get much better.

The Mavs are getting worse. The Warriors are much worse.

We are not getting worse then last year.

by Phoenix Stan on Nov 30, 2008 9:01 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

nice post – i feel your frustration…

by SDU on Nov 30, 2008 3:43 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

Never give up

or go root for some other team. I just see at team that is in store for some down time. This team will battle Dallas for the eighth seed in the West. Two wins out of 11 are good wins, Spurs ( without Ginobli) and the Pistons.
 I sense the players are all frustrated, and the annointed one, Amare wants to be the “Man”. There is non-basketball issues and basketball issues and I don’t see it ending anytime soon.

"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"

by Grockcubs on Nov 30, 2008 9:47 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

We need changes

I am almost glad the defeat against the Heat in order to realize that the team does not play well. Then I will explain my Decalogue:
1 .- Sacq cann’t be the team’s role model.
2 .- Amare needs more prominence.
3 .- If there are no changes in the roster, we need to make changes in the rotation of players.
4 .- We need a point guard.
5 .- Sacq and Amare are incompatible.
6 .- Lopez has to play more minutes.
7 .- The main team has to be quick to take advantage of better Nash and Barbosa.
8 .- The second team has to play as Porter likes: control and defense.
9 .- First team : Nash, Barbosa-Barnes-Amare-Lopez
10 .- Second Team : Singletary-Bell-Hill-Diaw-Sacq.

by matrix7 on Nov 30, 2008 11:14 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

Great rotation idea

I agree with bullets #9 and 10 from Matrix7’s post.

Starter team lead by Nash plays uptempo
Bench team lead by a rookie to hold the fort (keep the lead or keep us in the game) by playing a slow half court game)

by Nashbeliever on Nov 30, 2008 12:47 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I also agree

wholeheartedly with 9 and 10. When shaq came here, I thought he was going to come off the bench. I dont care if you are a huge star, and you’re numbers are still great, give that same effort coming off the bench. Its already a tough enough challenge to find a starter to match-up against shaq, good luck finding somebody to guard him coming off the bench.

I do, however, feel very optimistic about Tucker. I view him as being able to pick up what was lost when we lost Marion. We need another fast slasher. Somebody that can drive to the basket and finish. Bring back the alley-oop!!!

by KnowGood on Nov 30, 2008 2:59 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I know it has been said

but I’ll start Barbosa over Raja any day. Rotations need to change. That’s the type of adjustment that Porter needs to make. In-game adjustments!
Being able to read what strategy is the other team using and adjust accordingly, put the right players on the court for the type of play that you are trying to run. That’s what concerns me about TP.

If you look at our Stats, we are doing good: Good FG%, Good rebounding, we still score a lot of points and we are holding opponents under 100 points in most of the games.

I’ll cut Porter some slack since the season just started, this team has a lot of talent and I still believe we are contenders but Porter needs to figure out a way to use that talent so the offense can flow.

Season just started, we are going to be fine.

"Basketball doesn't build character. It reveals it"

by PanamaSun on Nov 30, 2008 1:59 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

and no depth

behind Raja either. How many games now have Steve, Raja and LB all been available at the same time?

by Phoenix Stan on Nov 30, 2008 2:23 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not giving up.

Sure things may not be the greatest for the Suns. But I’m not giving up. I’m a Suns fan and Steve Nash fan ( being in Victoria, B.C. Canada his hometown ). Must stand by the Suns win or lose. I’m not giving up. GO SUNS!

by CanadianBlazerfan on Dec 2, 2008 6:05 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

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