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Around SBN: Post-UNC Thoughts

Kerr pushes the panic trade button (again)

I don't like this trade. Fans are supposed to freak out and play the trade machine. Not General Managers and that's exactly what this feels like. Let's break it down:

  • Bell needed to go. He was unhappy with the new system and his game has declined as a result. He was no longer a top or even decent defensive player and while his stand still shooting has been great he can't do ANYTHING else on the floor with the ball. He's become an unhappy one-trick pony locker room cancer. Good ridence. Enjoy Charlotte and take all the shots you want.
  • Diaw was playing well this season except for the past few games which very well could be related to the trade rumors. On the radio they are saying that they wanted to move Boris because he is soft. The problem is that Boris is a very versitile player who has the ability to start and score in the post or driving the lane. His outside shot is solid and he's a very underrated defender. I don't think it was worth moving Diaw just to dump Bell. Mostly though this leaves the Suns VERY thin up front. Does Amundson now get those minutes? Is Lopez ready to play 15 - 20 minutes per game now? This really doesn't make much sense.
  • Singletary I am fine with. I know he's looked ok and certainly better then Dargic so far but I really don't see this kid making it in the NBA and the word is the Suns will sign a vet PG to fill the final roster spot. I don't have a clue who that might be but at least Smush Parker is off the market.
  • JRich is a great player. A solid character guy and a leader type. He is shooting 45% from 3 and can create and play above the rim. And he can finish which Raja can't even spell. I have no problem with JRich except that he doesn't have a great reputation as a defender (but does rebound well) and what does this do to LB and Tucker? Those guys can forget about getting minutes right? And will JRich be happy without having the ball as much because there are already not enough shots to go around between Shaq, Amare, Nash, Hill and Barbosa.
  • Jared Dudley is an unknown. I will be honest. I have never heard of this kid but what I've read so far is ok. But now we have three small forwards and no real legit backup at the four. That's fine if Amare is going to play 40 minutes per game and never go down but that's not very realistic is it?
  • I LOVE the fact that Bell and Diaw get to play with Larry Brown. That should be a perfect fit!

We moved Marion in a panic deal because he was a locker room cancern and now Kerr is pulling the trigger like a fantasy league GM on another rushed deal. I am not against a trade but I have to think that we could have moved Bell somewhere else like Memphis and got a young PG in return or perhaps to a young team like the Bucks or Nets for a vet big like Gadzuric.

We give up a very solid front line back up and add a guy that needs the ball on a team without enough balls and another small forward when we've already got two starters in that position.

At this point you have to wonder if Barbosa might be next to go and complete the purging of D'Antoni's boys.

 

Star-divide

Steve Kerr is on the radio:

  • Talking to Charolotte few weeks. Heated up in the last few days
  • Needed to shake things up
  • Get players we are high on - JRich 20 ppg
  • Called JRich "excellant defender"
  • J Dud - jack of all trades (2 3 or 4)
  • Loved him out of BC
  • Thanks to Raja and Boris yadda yadda
  • No question Raja was uneasy about changes - his time here had run it's course
  • Debatable if Raja was unhappy (really?)
  • JRich 4 yrs younger and explosive player
  • JRich versitile player. Runs. 3's. Creates.
  • VERY excited to come here
  • Need people that are excited to be here - both guys fired up to come here
  • Needed to mix things up and get better at that position and put guys on roster that are excited to be here
  • Every team needs to make changes. Things have changed here. Feeling around team not as exciting (in arena)
  • We needed to inject life into the organization
  • Financially is a total wash this year and next. Straight basketball move for both teams
  • Key with Boris - best year was when Amare was out. Hard to incorporate him into situation w/ Amare.
  • Felt better about allocating big contract to starting player with 35mpg. Boris contract didn't fit in our salary structure
  • Fans feel that team was further away from championship
  • My job to constantly look to make team better
  • We are in 2nd tier of teams behind LA, Boston and Cleveland with Spurs, Rockets, Hornets, etc
  • Looking at backup PG to fill final roster spot. Dragic has struggled (duh). Have some ideas. Have two weeks to sign someone
  • Tucker will be active tonight but might not be ready to really play much (first game after being out 5 weeks)

 

 

 

Poll
Rate the trade
Love it - dump Raja and Boris and get JRich. Brilliant
198 votes
Panic. We could have done better and are thin up front
96 votes
Not sure yet. I will tell you after the history is written
116 votes

410 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs  |  Comment 42 comments |

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Comments

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Panic?

Bell has been declining since last year at this time.

The Full French is not worth $9M a year. He wsn’t gettin gminutes because the Suns have bigs and have a few playmakers. I’m sad to see him not develop, as he was developing, but does he fit in anymore?

More importantly, how will I get my Dirty fix? Will I have to change my avatar?

The Suns are pretty stocked at the 2-3 position, aren’t they?

I’ve got no problem with Sweet Lou White Bo Outlaw and Fropez getting a few more “energy” minutes.

And, he’s reuniting two of the Warriors from the Upset Series. That’s Nellie-Ball, not Plop-A-Pop

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 10, 2008 4:51 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Clarification

The Suns have some good bigs. Diaw seemed to be one of them. I’m not sure how many good ones you can have one the same team.

He was probably the best defender thus far this year. That will hurt. That is a move from Porter’s purported emphasis on defense

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 10, 2008 4:56 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Seriously....I'm so confused.

I don’t mind Raja “the player” going, but Raja as a person I’m going to miss.

And I LOVE Boris Diaw.

Our backup front line is turrible now…we need another big.

WTF is Kerr doing? He’s made this team even more run and gun by trading our last two competent defenders. We have ZERO defense now. ZERO.

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Dec 10, 2008 4:58 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I'm disappointed in your evaluation.

Jared Dudley is serious hidden value in this trade. Look at his stats. He never turns the ball over, and is a well-respected to great on the ball defender (his BC pedigree as well as his first round selection will tell you the rest).

He can play the SF/PF and has a very similar body to Diaw…except he’s not frail, or dainty like Diaw.

We’ve needed another player who can create, and Richardson is just that. He is among the top 5 in 3 pointers made every season, and him and Amare in the same lineup is absolutely athletically freaky.

And again, I don’t quite see where you find any progress in Diaw this season. I’ve watched every game, and even if you haven’t seen any games, a quick review of his stat line will tell you everything you need to know about him. Diaw is a cancer, a 9 million dollar cancer, and thank the lord that he isn’t our problem anymore…

This is our shot, and i’m glad Kerr took it.

take, that

by sdot on Dec 10, 2008 4:59 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Diaw's Stat Line

Really doesn’t tell it all as he’s logging about 5 less minutes a game.

He scored slightly more last year simply becuase there were more shots to go around. This year, his points count more and he was being aggressive around the rim.

He is overpaid.

No more dirty photos …

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 10, 2008 5:02 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I kinda figured

Kerr would panic and remake the ’Cats.

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 10, 2008 5:10 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I don't understand your negativity

This is a fantastic trade. Richardson is still 27 years old. Sure he’s owed 40 million over the next 3 years, but I’d rather be on the hook to him than giving Diaw 9 million a year for an occasional spot of brilliance. Richardson is capable of getting his own points, which means you don’t need Nash on the court to always get a good offensive possession. No he isn’t a great defender, but like you said it’s not like Bell was playing great defense either. Dudley isn’t a total stiff, he can play decent backup PF minutes and you can even put Barnes at PF, Amare at center against smaller teams.

What do you see in a 14 ppg with no jumper that makes one think he will be better than a 26ppg\ 12rpg guy? Is there some kind of magic formula that tells you 14 > 26??
by Dabullsfan on Jul 1, 2008 10:19 AM CDT actions actions 0 recs

by Ozzie Montana on Dec 10, 2008 5:14 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Don't get too excited

I’m in faovr of the trade (Stan’s a pessimist, as I’ve pointed out before), but JRick is not going to carry the team by “creating” his own shots.

His overall FG% (like Bell’s) is lower than his 3Pt%. It’s an improvement, but the Suns are defintely losing some good players.

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 10, 2008 5:19 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not sure what I think of this for the Suns...

… but I know I hate it for the Bobcats.

Boomshakalaka

by jksnake99 on Dec 10, 2008 5:18 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

No doubt there

hard to see how this helps the Cats at all. I guess we will see what Boris can do getting starters minutes. Don’t be surprised if he plays well. But Bell is a dud at this point and Sean was salary filler

by Phoenix Stan on Dec 10, 2008 5:21 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Goodbye Raja and Boris....

Raja: Thank you for your defense and intensity through the years…I will never forget your clothesline of Kobe, your ice-water-in-your-veins 3 over Daniel Ewing, and your impact on this team. I will miss watching you play and hope that you can carve out more time in your career…I will not, however, miss your negative attitude; I understand your loyalty to D’Antoni, but this is a new team now, and I’m surprised you didn’t find a role.

Boris: Your talent is unmistakable. Your effort, however, was lacking at critical times, and I, too, will miss you on the dirty. You will find Charlotte has plenty of teenage women for you to find…Good luck in Charlotte…I’ve heard your new coach can be a little cranky.

by ArizonaCactus on Dec 10, 2008 5:27 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Diaw fans?

Seriously, you exist? I’m baffled.

He’s never been worth the salary just dishing wide open shots season after season. I’m glad he’s gone, but I don’t understand the hastiness of dealing Bell. I’m sure his slump is only because he knew something was up. But he’s always been somewhat streaky.

I didn’t think it was possible to blow up a team any more than last season. Didn’t anticipate anything like this. I could over-think this, but last season was lesson enough not to even bother. Overall, I feel mixed. And very gunshy.

Farewell, Raja.

by JohnnyyGo on Dec 10, 2008 5:31 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Yep, I'm a huge Diaw fan.

Trust me, we’ll miss him more than you think.

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Dec 10, 2008 5:38 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

If only

Marion wasn’t traded, the Suns would have the ultimate run and gun team:

Nash, Barbosa, J-Rich, Marion, Amare. Every game would be 120 points plus.

by Fundefined on Dec 10, 2008 5:37 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

yup

that would have been pretty incredible to watch.

by brian13 on Dec 10, 2008 5:47 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

phew

absolutely right. no team could catch that. far too fast to guard and far too accurate to stop.

by KnowGood on Dec 10, 2008 5:59 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I loved Diaw, didn't want to see him go

But J-Rich can ball, had no problem sharing the touches in Golden State, and can create his own shot.

by hcblankscreen on Dec 10, 2008 5:48 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

From Mark Stein...
Bell, though, was possibly Nash’s closest friend on the team, so the trade does come with an emotional component for Phoenix.

This is true. I know Nash is always professional, but I wonder how much this will bother him.

by brian13 on Dec 10, 2008 5:50 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Listen, Bell isn't that washed up

I mean really, when Phoenix Stan wrote in the initial blog that Bell isn’t even ‘a decent defender’ he was flat out wrong. Bell was never a stats inclined defender, but a good perimeter guy who could frustrate the other team’s superstar.

People like Kobe ALWAYS seemed to score on Bell, but Raja’s toughness was meaningful. He gave us that hard-nosed attitude, that we need.
Look, if you truly don’t think Raja was even a ‘decent’ defender, than please, somehow, explain to me how having LB or J-Rich is going to make guarding Kobe/D-Wade/CP3 easier? HOW!
Bell wasn’t perfect, but he sure as hell was better than our current alternatives…
Shiiit

by willthehawk on Dec 10, 2008 5:53 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

+1 man, we are SCREWED defensively

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Dec 10, 2008 5:54 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Bell WAS a great defender

my issue is that this year he stopped playing that way. He wasn’t that hard nose guy anymore. Maybe b/c he was unhappy. Maybe age. Maybe b/c he was trying to clean up his image for his kids like he told Craig Sager in Dallas.

He used to be that guy. No longer.

And I agree w/ your point about how JRich helps (or doesn’t help) on D against Kobe, Roy, TMac, Monta, etc.

by Phoenix Stan on Dec 10, 2008 6:00 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Well.

That was unexpected.

Dunno how I feel about it yet.

by Azreous on Dec 10, 2008 6:12 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Bell was limited.

The suns have never had a real 2 guard to take pressure off of nash. Bell had no ability to create and wasn’t a ball handler. He is a good defender and good 3 point shooter, but the suns have plenty of three point offense. The goal is to take pressure of nash, so he can come out of the game and not have everything go to hell. This will bring a dynamic to the suns that hasn’t there for a while. As for Boris. Tremendous talent, played his best ball before he got a big contract, but his defense was suspect and he doesn’t come to play every night and is often time frustrating to watch. The suns just got better.

by cabezonication on Dec 10, 2008 6:31 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

real 2 guard

J-Rich = Joe Johnson junior?? JJ is a better defender and passer, and better overall shooter. I imagine they shoot 3’s about the same. Richardson isn’t that much worse than JJ is any area methinks.

by Suns' Sensei on Dec 11, 2008 2:47 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

He's a worse distributer, worse ball handler, worse midrange shooter, and a much, much worse defender

I don’t know about rebounding.

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Dec 11, 2008 6:30 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I'll miss Raja more with my heart then my head

I personally like this trade 1000% more then the Marion-Shaq deal. I think Richardson gives the Suns the first legit 20 ppg 2-guard since Joe Johnson left. Plus I think he’ll be very motivated since he’s leaving the purgatory that is the Bobcats.

I loved watching Bell play (especially during 05-06), I’ll miss his intensity and heart, but he’s been declining a lot lately. His PER is only in the 9’s (not that I treat John Hollinger’s numbers as gospel, but that’s extremely low for a starting player). Diaw’s one of the most talented players on the team, but watching him was like seeing a carrot on a stick. He can play all the time like he did during the 06 playoffs, but I doubt he ever will.

I don’t know if Michael Jordan pulled the trigger for the Bobcats on this trade, but if he did, it’s just another crappy move he’s made. Even though he’s my childhood idol, I have to admit as a front office guy, he’s barely above Isiah Thomas/Matt Millen territory.

by Kwama79 on Dec 10, 2008 6:42 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I agree with your subject.

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Dec 10, 2008 7:14 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Farewell

I was very surprised when I heard about the trade(s). I loved Raja, but agree that it was time for him to go. Just didn’t see his attitude or effort improving in this system anytime soon.

As for Diaw, I loved him even though it was fun to yell at the TV when he’d pass rather than score. I can see him becoming the 2005-2006 player if given the chance in Charlotte.

As for the new players, I really don’t remember J-Rich very well and never heard of the other player at all.

by TwinnerA on Dec 10, 2008 7:44 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

As a long-time Warrior fan...

…who always hated the Suns, I might actually start pulling for you.

Barnes is over-rated, but JRich is a great pick-up — guaranteed. He can take over the game, is a long and strong 6’6 and gets his share of boards. Not a great one-on-one defender, but good team defense. He also brings intangibles. He wants to win as bad as anyone on the floor and he’s just entering his prime. He is a player who could help bring you Suns a championship. I didn’t follow Diaw and Bell closely, but they always seemed 2nd tier. JRich is unselfish and committed to winning. He wears number 23 for a reason.

by chiefbluefeather on Dec 10, 2008 8:31 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I’m glad someone gets it.

by underxthebridge on Dec 11, 2008 8:36 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Polls

I like the way you always put a backhanded insult in there for the psuedo-intellectuals, Stan. (still can’t spell, airport beer is wearing off)

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on Dec 10, 2008 11:14 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

just woke up

8 AM in Hungary now, to find THIS on NBA.com this trade is GREAT. jared dudley is a really really good pickup, decent defender and worker, he’ll do whatever he is asked to do. kind of like renaldo balkman, i guess you have heard about him enough to know what i am talking about. j-rich is very very good, and as pointed out before: he was doing fine in the “Golden State Upset Season for the Ages”, even though there was s-jax, boom dizzle, and a slew of other shooters and scorers. he’ll do fine here, especially with his long shooting and great penetration (wow. this sentence is really oozing of homosexual connotations)

Once upon a time the Suns got out on the break... and along came Steve sucKerr

by Murcy on Dec 10, 2008 11:51 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

This is a terrible trade.

Honestly, Kerr is a terrible GM and just needs to be let go before he decides to just release Steve Nash. He has done nothing but ruin what was the most exciting team in the NBA since his first day on the job. It’s sad but if it weren’t for David Stern in the ’07 playoffs then this discussion would probably never be happening and everyone would still be talking about what a genius Mike D is.

As for the trade, it completely contradicts what Kerr claims the franchise needed and that was focus and intensity on defense. So if this was the team’s major problem why would he trade away the one player who actually had this calling card for a guy that is just as absent minded on defense as the rest. They also lose their most versatile player on both offense and defense which be even more problematic considering the troubles this team has had with establishing its identity. I also don’t know a guy who is best friends with the leader of this team can be considered a cancer. But whatever, the Suns will be just as irrelevant in the playoffs after this trade as they were before..

by turs12 on Dec 11, 2008 1:37 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

I think it's a pretty good trade

I think Diaw was the best defender on our team, That’s not really saying much, but still…Raja was getting old. He was still an average to above average defender, but I certainly don’t think he’s a All-NBA defender. The drop off from Raja’s defense to J-Rich’s is no longer as big as it used to be for sure. The best thing about Bell was his contract which expired after next season I think. I like J-Rich, but I’m no sure how the Suns spread shots between him, Nash, LB, STAT, and Shaq. I wouldn’t be surprised if Kerr is trying to trade Barbosa, a pick and Hill or Barnes for a good big man. I don’t know if it’s enough to get a Kaman or Pryzbilla, though that’d be nice. I think of it this way – if Bell and Singletary ran into each other and were out for the season, would it really matter? Probably not. Diaw does matter from time to time, but I think the players we received matter more consistently.

by Suns' Sensei on Dec 11, 2008 2:45 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

Good Trade

Maybe it’s a good trade in terms of talent giving up vs. player quality/talent receiving but it just doesn’t seem to be consistent with the everything the Suns have been saying that they’re trying to do this year like focus on defense (neither players gained are defensive minded) or playing two different styles (which Diaw blends well into).

by turs12 on Dec 11, 2008 9:59 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Is 2007 team all but gone now?

So with this trade has Kerr completed the transformation?
Amare, Nash and Barbosa are all that remains right?

by CardsIrish on Dec 11, 2008 7:39 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

Yeah. It's kind of sad. Actually, it's really, really sad.

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Dec 11, 2008 6:31 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Amazing Move

How quickly have a lot of you forgotten the Golden State/Dallas matchup a few years back?

How crucial were Barnes and Richardson for Golden State in that series?

A+ trade. This team just got a lot stronger, and all that’s missing now is the veteran backup PG. Just wait and see.

by underxthebridge on Dec 11, 2008 8:36 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

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