League Acknowledges Blown Call
by JSun on May 28, 2008 11:22 PM MDT
19 comments
It's sort of refreshing, really. Two birds with one stone. The Sp*rs get robbed on a call and "the League" actually admits to a mistake. Here is a link. Well, they say it appears to be a foul on the replay. Really? Jumping on someone's head takes a replay to figure out?
I was waiting to see some of the other articles before posting something, but I really didn't see anything interesting. So, I put up my own boring post.
It was a foul on Fisher. It was on the floor and the Sp*rs were in the bonus. And it made a huge difference. Don't give me this, "It shouldn't have come down to that play." It came down to that play because, in the final 70 seconds of the game, the champs were about to pull one out. They were. Kobe mis-managed the clock by trying to go the length of the court. Fisher jacked up a bad shot because Kobe made a bad decision.* Gasol choked from the stripe.
On the other side, the Sp*rs executed and got off some quick shots. I was getting upset and worried because it looked like the Sp*rs were going to pull it out, then make a comeback and add to their legacy. That's the worst way to see your worst enemy win.
Back to the point:
When you've got two highly competitive teams competing at a high level, obvious gaffes like this do, in fact, affect the outcome of the games. Crappy statements like "We shouldn't have let it get this close" are inaccurate cliches. It is close because the teams are so evenly matched! A close call that goes the wrong way (e.g., was it a charge or a block?) can be forgiven. This, however, is flat-out wrong.
And don't give me the line that Barry should have gone straight up. He pump-faked the guy and tried to get around him. Instead of trying to draw a foul, he tried to win on a basketball move. By arguing that he should have "gone up strong to draw the foul" you are arguing that he did the wrong thing by giving a pump fake to get to an open spot. In my book, either play is acceptable, so don't penalize him for trying to make a jumper instead of trying to sell a foul.
At the same time, I'm glad the Sp*rs finally got screwed on a call. Having Crawford officiate that game only reinforces my tin-foil-hat-conspiracy-theory.
*Yeah, he did graze the rim and the shot clock should have re-set, but that mistake was only apparent in super-slo-mo. It wasn't an obviously bad call.
** On the "close call" issue -- I still have no problem with "exaggerating" a close call. This is not a flop; you're just helping the officials. "Flopping" is when no foul occurs but the player flails around as if he's been killed.
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Way to go , Joey
I think Joey finally got even with the Spurs.
by TheTruthSquad on May 29, 2008 12:04 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
because
I don’t think it should be a shooting foul
by Falcao on May 29, 2008 3:27 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
they were (I’m still convinced it would have been 2 foul shots).
Shaq:"The kobster, he's an assassin" Answer for who should be mvp.
by ldeep on May 29, 2008 8:48 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
got to admit the spurs are tough talkers.
Pop and Barry made no complaints and cried no tears over that call. I expect their fans to follow suit.
Wondering what the skip-2-my-loo to do next with my empty summer
by ZonaFlash on May 29, 2008 8:38 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Half the story
There is no such thing as an excusable blown call. So the league was correct to point out that Fisher did foul Barry.
But the league was incorrect not to point out that Odom also had an incorrect goaltend called against him and that Fisher’s shot did hit the rim, so the Spurs should not have had the ball in the first place.
So it is true that the Spurs got screwed by a bad call. But they were very lucky to even be in that position in the first place, since it required the officials making two other terrible calls.
But since the league didn’t mention those, so now lame conspiracy theories can continue to thrive.
Sven to Benfica! Please, please, please!
by rosewood on May 29, 2008 10:21 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Some bad calls are excusable, though
We really can’t expect the refs to be perfect. If it takes super-slo-mo to figure out, the play should be reviewed and the officials should strive to be better, but it is not necessarily a clear lapse in judgment. Clear lapses in judgment - not calling a foul when one player jumps on another player’s head - are inexcusable.
There are mistakes in life that, with hindsight, we realize are mistakes. Then, there are bone-headed moves that are obviously mistakes at the time. Odom’s goaltend was a tough call and is probably closer to the former category on the severity-of-mistake continuum. The Fisher non-call is squarely within the latter category.
I think most fans can live with close calls that are mistakes, so long as the refs acknowledge them and try to get better. Well, at least the rational ones. Radicals are never happy. However, when the league refuses to admit mistakes that irritates some.
What gets under most fans’ skin is the obviously blown call.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
by JSun on May 29, 2008 2:16 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fisher's shot
did not require slo-mo. I gave a quick “What the fuck!” as soon as TNT came back from commercial and I realized the shot clock had not reset. That was inexcusable. The Odom block was a difficult but clearly incorrect call.
I would prefer the NBA not apologize for any calls or submit full game reports to the public. As it stands right now, people are actually convinced that the Spurs got screwed, when in fact they were very lucky.
Sven to Benfica! Please, please, please!
by rosewood on May 29, 2008 2:43 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fisher's shot
Is harder to characterize as a tough close call. In real-time, though, I didn’t have the same reaction. I thought it hit the rim, but was not convinced so I didn’t really think much about it.
The Spurs got some lucky breaks at the end of the game, but the Lakers also made some bone-headed moves. Also, the Spurs stunk up the joint but were only behind by 7 with about a minute to go. You’ve got to give them some credit (not luck) for sticking close and making a lot of their opportunities down the stretch.
I’m not saying the NBA should apologize, but a little more “transparency” is appropriate (as promised last year about this time). The NFL does a decent job of explaining what it’s calling, and how it is going to cause fouls. E.g., holding cannot occur when the lineman’s hand are between the defensive player’s shoulder-pads. Everybody knows that and so no one complains about that non-call. Stuff like that.
So, I’m kind of agreeing with you that there shouldn’t be a de-briefing after every game, but I still think that explanations or admissions of fault are sometimes in order.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
by JSun on May 29, 2008 3:58 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
while you're on the subject
I’ve made a few real boneheaded mistakes in my life that I would like to be called back…. I never should have gotten involved with that dark-haired woman in 1992
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on May 30, 2008 3:00 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
JSun
I really like what you’ve written here – you provide excellent perspective. The only thing I can’t agree with is your assertion that “the Spurs finally got screwed on a call.” Believe me, the Spurs have been screwed many times…
by 4Him on May 29, 2008 2:25 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure you think the Sp*rs are repeatedly screwed by bad officiating
But, from my point of view, the Sp*rs have been getting the benefit of all the bad calls for years.
It’s a biased-fan-point-of-view-thing. Like, I don’t know, Duncan and Bowen coming off the bench during Game 4 last year during the Jones-Elson altercation. Just a thought.
Tough luck.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
by JSun on May 29, 2008 3:45 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, got to disagree with you
First of all, I don’t think the Spurs were screwed – at least not just them. I’d say every team receives the same number of ‘screws’ if we believe that refs are unbiased and in the theory of randomness.
Second, I agreed with a lot of fans that Spurs were lucky (not screwed) to be in the position they were in (down 2 pts. and 2 some seconds to go). Fisher’s shot should have reset the shot clock which of course wouldn’t get Kobe into forcing a fadeaway from downtown.
Third, had Brent tried to shoot the 3 despite of seeing Fisher crashing into him, he would have got the call. BTW, w/ only 2 seconds, why did he try to evade a defender to find a open shot when in fact he was open?
Well, glad that the league admits its mistake but let it go instead of having the final seconds replayed. If it decides to replay, everyone would have requested that it also reviews the shot Fisher took and perhaps changed the outcome to the Lakers’ favor anyway.
by majesticblue on May 29, 2008 3:44 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
No Replay
No one’s saying anything should be replayed. Again, admit where there’s a mistake and promise to try to do better. That is all.
The only thing I disagree with is the argument that Barry should’ve gone up for the three to draw contact. The argument is essentially that Barry should not have given a pump fake to get around the defender. Look, Barry probably can’t pull that play off against a good defender like Manu could, but the fact is that he was making a basketball play and not trying to draw a foul.
On the clock-reset thing, the reason that Fisher jacked that one up (wasn’t if funny how the ball bounced off of Horry’s knee as he stood there looking like an idiot?) was because Kobe kept the ball at midcourt until less than 10 seconds on the shot clock and when he couldn’t get anything, he threw a bad pass to Fisher putting Fisher in a bad situation.
I think most of the refs try to be unbiased, but its simply impossible to be. They’re watching great players, they’re affected by the crowds, they’re affected by the coaches. I think most of them try, but there is a lot of outside pressure that skews their calls. That’s why I can let them pass on “close” calls so long as they promise to try to improve. Those probably do even out and therefore do not count as “screw-jobs.”
Obviously bad calls, though, do affect games between two teams so evenly matched.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
by JSun on May 29, 2008 3:52 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Perhaps bad but good non-call in the last 60 seconds
This topic is going to stay hot for a while but there’s guideline in the league’s rulebook for calls during the last seconds of the game: if a call is to be made, it got to be CERTAIN. This means: if Barry shot the ball as Fisher landed into him or if he flopped backward in larger motion, he would have gotten the call.
BTW, Joey Crawford WAS NOT in the position to make that call because he was behind and to the left of Barry. Joe Forte was in front of and to the right of Barry.
Here’s a copy & paste from LA Times quoting Pop’s words (he said that before the league’s statement today):
[“It’s a very strange thing,” said Popovich, also before the league’s statement. “If you talk to an official, the official will tell you that the game is called at the end of the game exactly like it is during the meat of the game. That’s their story and they’re going to stand by it. In reality, personally, I don’t think that’s true and I can give a thousand examples that things are called differently down the stretch where I think most referees feel - and I agree with them - that things need to be more definitive before you’re going to make a call. A referee is going to be hesitant to make a call that could decide a game at the end unless it’s really either gross or obvious. So, that’s why I said, if I was an official, I would not have called that a foul at the end of the game.”]
by majesticblue on May 29, 2008 5:08 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Certainty?
if Barry shot the ball as Fisher landed into him or if he flopped backward in larger motion, he would have gotten the call.
Isn’t that the problem with flopping? Has it gone so far that a flop is required to get a call?
I can live with the “certainty” explanation, but I’m pretty damn certain that jumping on top of someone is a foul. I know Pop’s staying in character and doing the thing that his team needs him to do, and I wish D’Antoni could have done the same instead of stomping off the podium like a child and throwing crumpled paper around. Just because Pop says it now, though, don’t believe that’s what he’ll be saying when he’s retired.
Joey Crawford wasn’t the culprit? There goes my conspiracy theory … nahh, I’m sticking to it.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
by JSun on May 29, 2008 6:23 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Titanic Admission
Isn’t this whole thing kinda like old coot Rose throwing her big diamond into the ocean before she kicks it? Missed calls that encourage flopping are extremely big deals. Acknowledging the mistake and learning nothing from it, changing nothing, just leaves a big ol’ ocean of the same old stuff. Somehow I don’t see the league truly working to affect meaningful change here…and the same old stuff’s just going to keep happening.
Maybe I’m just grouchy because I can’t stand that the Lakers are in the finals. Not that seeing the Spurs there would have been any better.
---sunnie
by Sunnie on May 30, 2008 9:44 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
The NBA has made too many mistakes in big moments to claim ’’it’s no big deal.’’ From Richie Powers’ ’’I didn’t want to see it end that way’’ to the Kings in 2002 to last year, it’s difficult NOT to think the NBA has agendas. Remember ’’It’s not about fairness, it’s about correctness?’’ Well, correctness still becomes their interpretation. In the end, the little guy gets it. I’m not saying SA is the little guy, but when big $ are looming through a Lakers-Celtics final, you’ll get calls like this. You’ll get Garnett grabbing an official and getting away with it. You’ll get guys leaving a bench and NOT getting suspended THIS time.
Fairness? Correctness? Flopping, not flopping? It’s irrelevant. ESPN has bought into the ‘great rivalry’ propaganda and has swept Horry’s shoulder and Donaghy under the carpet. Kobe wanting to be traded has gone away. The league is saved!
Love, Winston Smith
Gar Heard was three years early.
by jerseysunsfan on Jun 1, 2008 10:07 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
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