A Tale of Two GMs or a Tale of Two O'Neal
A tale of Two GMs or a Tale of Two O'Neal
This retrospective has nothing to do with current events, but carries on with my morbid fascination about might-have-beens regarding the pieces of the magical 7SOL era. While I constantly follow Mike D'Antoni and Shawn Marion, this post is about former Suns GM Bryan Colangelo, who I actually harbor much internal appreciation for.
By comparison, to some fans, GM Steve Kerr will always be the moron that blew up 7SOL in favor of championship calibre uber phail. Kerr came sweeping into the Suns and snatched defeat from the jaws of victory, single-handedly crippling the magic of the Phoenix Suns masterpiece put in place by none other than two-time executive of the year and former GM Bryan Colangelo. Some people wish BC was still running the Phoenix Suns.
Here's a tale of two GMs. Or two O'Neal. Who's the bigger moron?
| Details | GM Steve Kerr | GM #2 |
| Traded For | S. O'Neal | J. O'Neal |
| Salary | $20,000,000 | $21,372,000 |
| Traded away | Shawn Marion, Marcus Banks (MB addition by subtraction) | TJ Ford, first round #17 2008 NBA Draft (Roy Hibbert), 11 million in expiring contracts |
| Player performance (2008-09) | 17.8ppg, 61.1% eFG, 8.4 rpg, 30mpg, +4 +/- | 13.5ppg, 47.3% eFG, 7.0rpg, 30mpg, -2 +/- |
| Honors (2008-09) | All-star | - |
| Team Performance |
57%, 63-47 (110 games) | 36%, 15-26 (41 games) |
| Past Performance | 70%, 38-16 (first 54 games 2008-09) | 50%, 41-41 (2008-09) |
| Traded for |
Luxury tax savings ($11MMx2) | Shawn Marion, Marcus Banks (Marion converted into $$$, MB subtraction by addition), $3 million cash |
| Traded away | Poor pick'n'roll defense, personality, high percentage offense | J. O'Neal, Jamario Moon, lottery-protected first-rounder, $4.2 million trade exception |
To summarize, although the Suns topped the division at the time of the trade, the balance of power in the Western Conference changed radically with "The Gift of Gasol". There was no way the Suns, as comprised in March 2008 was going to make a title run against the new Lakers. Shaq was a big gamble for glory. Although it failed, we were going to lose Marion anyway, so it cost us some playoff series and some luxury tax money, but it did not cost us much more long-term.
In contrast, GM #2 (Bryan Colangelo) burned up two first round draft picks, traded away both TJ Ford and Jamario Moon, traded away $11 million in expiring contracts, took on the Suns declining players and the albatross of Marcus Banks all for the opportunity to have an injured, overpaid big that failed to perform. At best, this was a copycat style move that was as bad as the Shaq trade and probably much worse. The only positive commendation is that BC spared no expense in getting out of the bad trade in great haste. He only put up with Jermaine O'Neal for 41 games.
Shamsports summarizes the Colangelo regime in Toronto here best:
Do you know what the most annoying thing in the world is? It's Toronto Raptors fans when talking about Bryan Colangelo. By miles. There is nothing more annoying in the world than this. Nothing. Not a sausage. Not even scrotal crabs or Ron Artest's Twitter account are more potently insufferable than listening to Raptors fans drool on about Colangelo as being some kind of flawless freak of genius, who transcends general managerial conventions to achieve an unparalleled plateau of superlativityness. They make me advocate chemical warfare. It's intolerable.
So let's use some perspective on that, shall we? Colangelo inherited a 27 win team with Chris Bosh, Jose Calderon, max cap room and the #1 overall pick. He didn't earn those things; he already had them when he got there. Three years later, the Raptors had Chris Bosh, Jose Calderon, their balls grazed against the tax threshold.....and all of 33 wins. That is not. Good. Sure, they won the Atlantic division title the year before, but there's a reason they went so far backwards, and that reason was Colangelo's dire 2008 offseason.
All that, and in the Eastern Conference.
4 recs |
29 comments
Comments
+1
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Oct 20, 2009 10:08 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
I feel bad
for Jamario Moon. A couple of years ago, he was a promising rookie-turned-starter on the Raptors, and now he’s a journeyman who’s filling a gap on the Cavs and won’t get any notice at all.
by jburning on Oct 20, 2009 2:37 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
The cream comes to the top, no? I like Moon, too. He’ll get his.
by Wil Cantrell on Oct 20, 2009 4:33 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
i agree.
i think he’s got the smarts to put it together, and i think he understands that being patient (for the time being) in cleveland is a decent move for him.
by iamtrevorpaxton on Oct 21, 2009 1:47 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Moon is an underrated pickup for the Cavs
Obviously Shaq (and Parker to a much lesser extent) took most of the headlines for the Cavs this past summer, but the addition of Moon should not be overlooked. The guy has a pretty decent jumper, he’s incredibly athletic, and is a lanky, decent defender.
Considering he has been in the league for a grand total of 2 years prior to this one, I don’t think you can discount him to “journeyman” status. He signed a 2-yr rookie contract with the Raps and got traded halfway through last season…when his (restricted) contract was up this past summer, he signed with a winning team that has a real shot at the title. Most any other franchise would have matched on his contract, but anyone who follows the NBA knows what the Heat’s financial situation/motivation is currently.
"I’m tired of hearing about money, money, money, money, money. I just want to play the game, drink Pepsi, wear Reebok." ~Shaq
by Max_in_Missouri on Oct 27, 2009 12:17 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Journeyman Moon
I think Moon gets the journeyman status due to being 29yrs old and having spent lots of seasons in the CBA and other leagues. The dude is no fresh fashed rookie. I agree he’s an underrated pickup, dude has skills that nicely complement the right system.
by eagleheart on Oct 27, 2009 1:54 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good observations
Good analysis of the situation with the O’neal trades.
I’d still take Brian Collangelo as GM over Steve Kerr any day and twice on Tuesdays.
I percieve from his performance as GM that Steve Kerr lacks integrity, while Brian is full of integrity.
Put it this way, if you were a player, who would you rather work for?
by eagleheart on Oct 22, 2009 1:41 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
thats interesting.
Obviously, BC because I expect him to overpay and he does. It’s nice but it doesn’t always make it better for the team or the fans.
However, I think Steve Kerr, for the most part, has been painfully and brutally honest, almost to a fault. Nothing like telling Amare and Shaq that they’re on the trading block in February or Shawn Marion that he’s not a max player.
I don’t always feel Sarver is honest, but I think Kerr has acted fairly as GM.
Wondering what to drink to during suns games...
by ZonaFlash on Oct 22, 2009 2:37 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good post, Zona
Although you forgot Shaq’s All-NBA honors in 08-09 :)
I agree that Steve Kerr has been honest (with everyone), maybe even too much so. I don’t think you can hate on the man for that…and I certainly would not agree with the implication that being honest makes one “lack integrity”. I wonder how Marion felt when he realized Kerr was honest with him and that he is, in fact, only a mid-level player (by definition of his contract)??
Thank you for acknowledging the “gift of Gasol” as well! People tend to conveniently forget that although the Suns had the best record AT THE MOMENT (and not by much) of the Shaq trade, the landscape in the West was changing.
As for using the word “magical” to the describe the 7SOL era, you could not be more correct. It was one hell of an illusion (that some fans STILL cling to) of championship contention. Obviously the Shaq trade didn’t work out great for anyone (except the Cavs), but I don’t think you can fault Kerr for taking a gamble with what he KNEW was not a contender.
"I’m tired of hearing about money, money, money, money, money. I just want to play the game, drink Pepsi, wear Reebok." ~Shaq
by Max_in_Missouri on Oct 27, 2009 12:44 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
illusion of championship contention
If you are regularly competing in the Western Conference finals and regularly have one of the best records in the NBA and are a hipcheck suspension away from making the finals, you are in title contention. Is that enough to guarantee a championship? No obviously not, but you are a contender.
by eagleheart on Oct 27, 2009 1:56 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see you are one of the fans I was referring to..... no offense, I hope
“hipcheck suspension” away from the finals? You do realize that Horry was on the OTHER team, right? How about we refer to all that nonsense as “Horry’s dirty play” or “Nash is soft” or “leaving the bench during the playoffs is borderline retarded and if you do so, you deserve to be suspended”?
That whole incident was pretty messed up for all parties involved, including the league. However, the worst part about that semi-close series loss was that it made the Suns faithful believe that they were headed in the right direction with their “we don’t need to even pretend we play defense” strategy. Just because the Spurs slipped up a little in the post-season, it was almost as if “the incident” somehow gave the Suns an excuse for losing but yet enough hope to continue the frivilous efforts in the same manor.
As for “regularly competing in the Western Conference finals” statement, one needn’t look to far to realize there is no merit to that comment. The Suns have made it to the Western Conference Finals exactly 2 times in the past 15 yrs, having lost both times.
To a Suns enthusiast, this may seem like a “title contender”…. to a student of the NBA game, it was just another fad.
"I’m tired of hearing about money, money, money, money, money. I just want to play the game, drink Pepsi, wear Reebok." ~Shaq
by Max_in_Missouri on Oct 27, 2009 2:52 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha lol
‘student of the NBA game’. Thanks, I nearly fell off my chair on that one.
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Oct 27, 2009 5:48 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Zero Substance
Just laugh whenever you can’t dispute the facts.
"I’m tired of hearing about money, money, money, money, money. I just want to play the game, drink Pepsi, wear Reebok." ~Shaq
by Max_in_Missouri on Oct 28, 2009 12:52 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Facts
Are for those who have no substance to their arguments and can be made to justify any argument for those whose have a pathological need to prop themselves and their opinions up.
Your facts mean nothing. And I’m still laughing.
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Oct 29, 2009 1:30 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Money for Nothing... and Chicks For Free...
Max, you obviously don’t consider yourself one of the “Suns faithful” by the way you refer to us in the third person and the condescending tone of nearly every post you write.
That’s fine, I understand the life of a bandwagoner is tough – there are so many ups and downs – new teams and players to learn every year, new fans to pretend to know more than, etc. Amidst all the confusion of a few seasons in transition where your previous bandwagon team is no longer the hyped team… I can understand that you might feel a little lost.
But no worries!! I’ve provided you with a few links to some teams I think you might be interested in following this season! But choose wisely because there are a lot of really good and trendy teams this year! (Personally, I would go with the Lakers… not only are they due for a repeat – but you can shove it down your previous team’s throat because you’ll still be in the same division! PLUS they have some of the bestest mostest friendliestest fans in the whole world who aren’t disillusional or anything!) Good luck! Bandwagon away my friend!
Silver Screen and Roll (Lakers)
Celtics Blog (Boring blog name.. but I hear they have a sweet team! And they play defense!)
Pounding the Rock (Spurs – old faithful!)
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Oct 27, 2009 10:22 AM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
lol hey now
Any fan that posts with us is one of us, even tho he proclaim to be otherwise.
I’m a total suns hater and a self-hater too. I see where Max is coming from, because I come from there too a bit. I question whether we were really as close as we like to think we were.
For all the Suns faithful there’s gonna be a few Suns heretics, but if they still follow the Suns in the offseason, in a season where we know our asses gonna be handed to us, that’s a fan.
And if ya gonna be a fairweather fan, Phoenix is the place to do it, it got lots of fair weather! =D
Wondering what to drink to during suns games...
by ZonaFlash on Oct 27, 2009 2:18 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Awwww, you're upset that I'm right
It’s ok, lil guy. You can completely ignore every fact that I posted and try to impune my credibility if that makes you feel better. Hell, your sorry attempts at personal attacks are more likely to win you an argument than the facts.
I am not one of the “Suns faithful”, nor have I ever claimed to be. I’ve rooted for them for a long time (not exclusively)… in kind of an “awww look at them, at least they’re trying” underdog sort of way. As should be no secret to anyone that has seen my posts, I am a huge Shaq advocate. I root for and appreciate Shaq more than anything else. When he was on the Suns, I rooted even harder for them to win…although with the other personnel and the way he was routinely underutilized by the coaching staff, I think we all knew the franchise was going no where.
You know what else? (oh, and you’ll LOVE this) I’m rooting for the Cavs to win with Shaq this year. Guess what else? They play defense and I’m pretty sure they won’t be whining about having to do so. I realize that is probably damn near blasphemus to say on this blog, but its a lot easier to root for a team that plays on BOTH ends of the floor. Substance over style.
If you have any FACTS you want discuss about my previous post, give it a try. Let’s try to avoid the highschool-esque personal attacks. Or wait, are you going to be one of those geniuses that points out Missouri doesn’t have an NBA team so I can’t possibly understand how the game works?
Just so ya know, you don’t have to a “fan” to post on a particular team’s blog. I’m all about the NBA and just like to discuss it with different people and fans of different teams. I’m also involved in the Jazz, Twolves, Kings, Pistons, Rockets, and Lakers blogs….and I assure you that I am in no way a fan of those teams.
Sorry, I’m not going to just come here and be another Bright Side of the Sun drone and say “Horry is the only reason the Suns didn’t win that year, SSOL would have produced an eight-peat but Kerr messed it up, chemistry is more important than a big man, if you outscore your opponent then you are playing good defense, and I wish I had an autographed bag of Nash’s feces to put on my nightstand”
Like I said, if you’ve got facts to discuss, I’m here and I’ll try to remember to check this more often.
"I’m tired of hearing about money, money, money, money, money. I just want to play the game, drink Pepsi, wear Reebok." ~Shaq
by Max_in_Missouri on Oct 28, 2009 12:51 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Struck a nerve I guess..
well, you’ll probably like my latest fanshot on Shaq.
As far as ‘facts’ go – your post was based on an opinion, that the 7SOL (or running style) is an illusion that Suns fans have mindlessly embraced… FYI – the Suns have been a running-high-offense team nearly their entire existence as a franchise. It’s our identity – and most Suns fans choose to accept it. We like to believe that we can prove those who say it can’t work wrong.
The only ‘facts’ we can use to discuss the issue is that the style has yet to win the Suns a championship. What do you want me to dispute with facts? The fact that it hasn’t been done doesn’t absolutely disqualify it from ever happening. Therefore any subsequent arguments about it are going to be drenched in opinions.
I guess I could argue that some of the 90’s Lakers team used an offense-heavy style to win championships… but I’ll even admit that would be stretching it.
When all is said and done Max – I hope you’re not too angry with me for calling your fan-status out as ‘bandwagon’ status – I didn’t mean to offend your personal-status.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Oct 28, 2009 3:23 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not only that
But half the league is buying into some form of 7SOL – we revolutionized the game. People found that, while it may not win a championship, it is pleasing to the eye. People WANT it to succeed. The only thing we want from the Spurs is their trophies – not their boring style of play.
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Oct 29, 2009 1:34 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Horry is the only reason the Suns didn’t win that year, SSOL would have produced an eight-peat but Kerr mess it up, chemistry is more important than a big man, if you outscore your opponent then you are playing good defense, and I wish I had an autographed bag of Nash’s feces to put on my nightstand.
…Man, we drones really love the run-on sentence.
by Azreous on Oct 30, 2009 7:30 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well the Fat Cactus didn’t help the Cavs get over the line against Boston today.
Good riddance.
by Chucko on Oct 27, 2009 8:45 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Shaque
Actually, Shaq and Lebron were the only guys who showed up for the Cavs in that game.
by eagleheart on Oct 28, 2009 1:13 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
time will tell
I’m interested to see what will happen.
Wondering what to drink to during suns games...
by ZonaFlash on Oct 28, 2009 1:34 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
This game illustrates my reservations
about the trade from the Cavs point of view. Cleveland made the jump to championship contender not because of talent as much as chemistry. We all know what Shaq can do to a team. Despite his initial assertions tthat he was in Phoenix to grab rebounds, start the break, and block shots, we soon saw Shaq griping about ‘touches’ and dominating the attention, and this clearly affected Amare. His massive ego changes everything. Last night, the other big guys, Ilgauskas and Varajao, were largely ineffective. Despite being fed the ball constantly, The Big Mistake only scored 10 points. In my mind he stagnated the Cleveland offense. I don’t think this will end well for the Cavs, but time will tell.
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Oct 28, 2009 11:11 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Cavs
issue is they still have no one else on the wings that can score consistently…Mo Williams is ok. D West is a mess.
If they are reliant on J Moon and A Parker they are hosed.
Now, if they could sign Candace Parker I might give them a chance…
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @phoenixstan
by Seth Pollack on Oct 28, 2009 11:18 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
You and the WNBA...jeez
"I’m tired of hearing about money, money, money, money, money. I just want to play the game, drink Pepsi, wear Reebok." ~Shaq
by Max_in_Missouri on Oct 28, 2009 12:30 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
See
I was just reading your other post about:
Sorry, I’m not going to just come here and be another Bright Side of the Sun drone and say "Horry is the only reason the Suns didn’t win that year, SSOL would have produced an eight-peat but Kerr messed it up, chemistry is more important than a big man, if you outscore your opponent then you are playing good defense, and I wish I had an autographed bag of Nash’s feces to put on my nightstand"
and nodding my head….then you had to go and say that
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @phoenixstan
by Seth Pollack on Oct 28, 2009 2:29 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

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