Suns Run Over Golden State Warriors 123 - 101
by Phoenix Stan on Oct 31, 2009 12:05 AM MDT
in Game Coverage
23 comments
By all accounts the Phoenix Suns ran right over the hapless Golden State Warriors. You can certainly give plenty of credit to the Suns good shooting (55% from three) and to a solid effort on the glass (47-38 rebounding advantage) but the bottom line is the Suns did what they had to do while the Warriors looked like a team that had no desire to play the game of basketball.h
You really have to feel for Stephen Curry who by all accounts is a solid kid. He's the one player both Coach Gentry and Steve Nash talked about post game as having a lot of potential and they both really seemed to think highly of him as a player. Unfortunately, he was drafted into a team that plays the game in absolutely the wrong way.
Only 16 total assists for the Warriors is an indication of how much of their play is about individual isolation and their lack of size is not made up for by overly aggressive or active defense. Maybe it was just a bad night for the Warriors but what they did tonight was an embarrassment to their great fans.
Not to take anything away from some bright spots on the Suns side of the ledger.
Most impressive was the growth and development of Amare Stoudemire. It's like watching another player out there. Gone are the amazing offensive moves and the explosive power game. In it's place is a more heady player who's defense is already much improved and who's outside shot is money.
"It's been amazing the transformation that he's had as far as the alertness and the weak side help and being in rotation. He continues to get better in that area right there. You know, his offense is going to come. We're not worried about that," said coach Alvin Gentry about Stoudemire's progression as a player.
Amare took two charges in this game. The first moving over and standing in perfect position to take a charge from Anthony Randolph right in the chest. The second was even more impressive as he moved his feet laterally and beat Corey Maggette to the spot to draw the foul. He also had a nice weak side block on Curry.
Of course, the big honors in this game go to Channing Frye who's first home game back in front of his native crowd saw him hit 6 or 7 from three and finish with 24 points. Asked if he was in a zone Frye responded, "Sorta, kinda. If I made 9 or 10 then I would be in a zone."
Frye knocking down shots certainly helped Steve Nash look even better. He finished with 20 assist which is the 6th time he's done that in his career and only the 13th time in Suns history. A guy named Kevin Johnson had the other seven.
Coach Gentry pointed out how we all can take Nash for granted, "You look down and he has 18 and 20. 18 points and 20 assists and you're like, that's what he's supposed to do."
Nash for his part was ever humble, "It's better than getting four, but for me I want to win the game. I can get five assists or 20 assist and if we win, it doesn't matter. If you get a bunch of assist, it means a lot of guys are scoring which is nice."
Nash still isn't nearly satisfied with where the team is offensively. He feels the Suns aren't running enough and are yet to find their rhythm as a team. He "blames" that in part on the new players and the need to spend more time on the floor together but he also thinks that the emphasis on defensive rebounding is pulling in the wings and preventing as many leak outs.
Even in a blow out game, Nash had 37 minutes. He emphasized that he feels great and thinks that he can play at this level all season long and into the playoffs. His minutes don't seem to be impacted by his lack of a solid backup, Goran Dragic who had another solid outing with 8 points and 4 assists in just under 14 minutes.
Nash said this about the development of his Slovenian understudy, "I think Goran's improving. Goran's got good tools. He just needs that confidence and comfort. He's going to struggle at times but I think you're going to see a big improvement from him."
Perhaps without Jason Richardson on the floor, Nash was needed a bit more in the three guard rotation. I would still like to see his minutes closer to 33 per game and he even admitted that those extra 3 or 5 minutes on the bench add up over the course of a season.
Nice game all around for the Suns despite the fairly pitiful effort from the Warriors. Coach Gentry is looking for his team to protect home court stating that most 50 win teams win 30 at home. So far, so good.
We'll close the recap with Channing Frye who summed up the game best in his remarks. Frye certainly has a career in broadcasting if that's where he wants to go when he hangs up the sneakers.
Post Game Links
My buddy Brett from AOL has a great take on the Warriors mess
Nelson's Curious Lineups Make Things Tough on Anthony Randolph -- NBA FanHouse
PHOENIX -- The Warriors played basketball like five individuals wearing the same uniform on Friday, instead of like an NBA team that was anywhere near
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The development of Amar'e
Usually when an athlete goes down with a major injury, it results in a big drop in their capabilities upon their return. Isn’t interesting that Amar’e’s injuries have all resulted in an improvement in his game? Where would he be without those injuries? Recovering from the knee he became a deadly jump shooter and free thrower. If recovering from the eye makes him a smarter defender and rebounder, will any athlete in history have benefited as much as Sun Tzu from his injuries?
From a philosophical standpoint, it has been true in my life that, when going through a challenge, it can feel like the whole world is against you. Looking back on them now, I am grateful for those terrible times because they taught me who I am and what’s important. I hope Amar’e can look back on these injuries and be grateful that they made him a complete player.
by tptman on Oct 31, 2009 12:35 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
The School of Hard Knocks
Fanaticism is not logical
by SunDolphin on Oct 31, 2009 7:23 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Amare continues to play with this demeanor..
then I will take back all the bad things I ever said about him. Of course, we’ve seen this before from him, in spurts, but this time, I must admit, it feels different.
The key for him is to continue to be mindful that stats are the result of good play, and not the other way around, that consequently sometimes you can play brilliantly without leaving a mark on the box score, and that it doesn’t matter when that happens, because sometimes you’ll get numbers you didn’t earn, and it all balances out over a season.
It’s no big deal to me that he didn’t get a whole bunch of boards individually, because the team did rebound well, as a unit. That was something nice about this game: like the scoring, the rebounding in the box score was spread out across the team. That generally tends to mean that players are doing their job in boxing out the opponent they’re covering before going for the ball, and basically playing team defense. It’s a big step forward for this team.
(As an aside, I wonder if people keep +/- stats for anything other than team scoring. Those would be interesting numbers to look at.)
Anyway, when Amare finally gets into shape, he may actually be close to being the player we all thought he’d mature into 5 years ago. It’s the first time, in a long while, that I’ve been able to say that with a straight face.
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on Oct 31, 2009 12:37 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
http://www.82games.com/0809/0809PHO.HTM
Click on a name and go all the way to the bottom. (stats from last year) :)
by dontTradeAaronNelson! on Oct 31, 2009 1:29 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not quite what I had in mind, but thanks..
I was looking for +/- stats on boards, dimes, etc…, on a per game basis, and possibly on a game stage basis (1st quarter, 2 mins before 1/2 time, crunch time, etc…)
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on Oct 31, 2009 10:53 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am no advance stats guy
but I don’t think that kind of detail is publicly available. Although, I did see somewhere that can down load the raw data from every play. The guys over at Hardwood Paroxysm did some fun stuff with that data.
Also try hitting up Kevin Pelton from Basketball Prospectus. He’s my go to guy anytime I have a serious stat question
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @phoenixstan
by Phoenix Stan on Oct 31, 2009 1:53 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
thanks...
it occurred to me that it might be possible to come up with some kind of “true contribution” metric, that showed the effect that someones play has on the whole team, at a deeper level than just scoring +/-, during meaningful stretches of the game.
For instance, you could ask the question how much better is the team at shooting/passing/rebounding/etc.. when player X is on the court. I’m betting that a player like Battier would have a much better true contribution score relative to other players than he would using his win score or PER.
I’ll definitely be looking to find that raw data, if I can.
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on Oct 31, 2009 2:11 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Check out
Pelton then. I am pretty sure he’s got a metric for that already…it’s called WARP or something
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @phoenixstan
by Phoenix Stan on Oct 31, 2009 3:25 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
WARP isn't what I had in mind either...
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on Nov 1, 2009 6:11 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Amare has been pivitol in both our two wins but you wouldn't know it by his line.
I’m proud of him. Subtle yet effecient.
Fanaticism is not logical
by SunDolphin on Oct 31, 2009 7:22 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good win
against a horrible team. I can see Golden St. unloading players come January. That being said, Nash remains a wonderful player. Frye could surprise this year, Hill, knock on everything that is wood, could really have found the fountain of youth at 37.
This year more than any, I really can’t get a take on this team, hard to figure out. I think the biggest question will be what the Suns will do with Amare. Amare I believe will not settle for nothing less that the max. out contract. And I just don’t see the Suns doing that deal. Time will tell. In the mean time, keep running.
by Grockcubs on Oct 31, 2009 4:25 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
In time, with experience, Goran will create his own confidence and not rely on his shot
And in time I think Stat will get a little bit of that slam dunk back. I saw it late in the game. But I said it in the game thread that I’d take this new and, I think, improved version of Stat if it means his mind is straight. Yeah, it’s DEFINITELY a lesser athletic version. Bye-bye the amazing dunks, but I think we’ve always needed Amare’s defense more than his offense. Now with his outside shot and his defense we have a more complete player, not just a slam dunk champion. And if this leads to a more focused, humble player, we’re simply going to get a better product. I’d resign this product, and let that slam dunk ego walk.
Will you guys forgive me for all the bad things I said about Nash in the last year? If he keeps this play up all season we’re gonna be where we want at the end. Of course I’m saying this after playing two of the easier teams in the NBA, one of which played more like the Raiders than the Warriors. We’re going to be tested and I want to see how this team responds to adversity. I can’t wait. I think this team will go the way Nash goes.
Fanaticism is not logical
by SunDolphin on Oct 31, 2009 7:20 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
forgiven
BUT – I think it’s premature to say “bye-bye to the amazing dunks” for Amare…. He’s had some ‘amazing dunks’ already this year and in the preseason. I expect they will return when his legs and explosiveness is back… anybody who has watched Vince Carter recently knows that if you’re gifted with skills… it’s going to take an AWFUL lot to dilute them.. and STAT injured his eye, not his legs this last year. I expect Amare’s vicious dunks to be back at some point – I will still stick by my 15-20 game buffer.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Oct 31, 2009 12:03 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
he should get a lot of that hops back but it’s going to take a lot of time in the gym as well. Fortunately, he’s putting in the work
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @phoenixstan
by Phoenix Stan on Oct 31, 2009 1:54 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
But his dunks won't be his game.
He’s not going to dunk over people 10 times a game like he used to. In the past his game was almost exclusively “inside.” I understand I could be wrong, but I hope I’m right. If he can play outside in, he’s gonna be an amazing player if not quite the highlight reel he once was. I’m licking my chops at this new possible incarnation of Stat.
Fanaticism is not logical
by SunDolphin on Oct 31, 2009 3:34 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why would eye-surgery
Make him any less explosive then he was last year?
by hcblankscreen on Oct 31, 2009 3:56 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lack of phyiscal activity
For months (like 6 of them) he was restricted from any physical activity. He could lift weights. Ride a bike. Work out at all. He was only cleared to start again a few weeks before training camp.
He lost some power in his legs during that time
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @phoenixstan
by Phoenix Stan on Oct 31, 2009 4:09 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lack of physical activity like Stan says, but also
He’s had 6 months to think about his game and get better at fundamentals away from the basket, which will enable him to go to other things during the game that aren’t simply dunking down throats. I’ve seen improvement in defense, not to mention a continuing of last years outside shot.
My point isn’t that he won’t ever dunk the ball again. My point is that I hope beyond hope that he doesn’t rely on the dunk to be effective. He used to be a very one dimensional player. Dunk or stand around. But if he can shoot from outside, play defense, and still dunk, he’ll be a much better player.
I don’t expect anyone to agree, but I believe a less “explosive” Stat is a better Stat. He’ll be a more calm and controlled player, without the huge ego associated with players that can just rip through other players like they were several leagues below in talent.
Fanaticism is not logical
by SunDolphin on Oct 31, 2009 8:32 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
interesting idea...
It will be fun to see what happens anyway
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @phoenixstan
by Phoenix Stan on Oct 31, 2009 8:51 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's bound to happen
As Amare gets older, he’s bound to lose some of the hops he’s had, not that he’s an old guy yet. The knee surgeries and the crazy eye injuries don’t help.
by eagleheart on Nov 2, 2009 12:00 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
First in the Pacific!
Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."
by rsavaj on Oct 31, 2009 4:33 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
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