Suns vs. Lakers, 11/12: What I see
by Jack Frost on Nov 10, 2009 10:15 AM MST
58 comments
I know, I know. The SUNS do play a feisty and dangerous Hornets team on Wednesday night. This is definitely a team and a game we do not want to overlook. The Hornets have had our number recently, so we do have something to prove on Wednesday. That being said, the matchup on Thursday with the LAKERS will be the biggest test thus far this season. One could argue the Boston game was, but this game will be for the lead of the Pacific Division and all NBA eyes will be on this contest.
Okay, first things first. Damn the NBA for yet AGAIN giving the Lakers every scheduling advantage for key games. I seem to remember this last season -- I believe it was for the first game in LA; we were playing the 2nd game of a back to back and the Lakers were coming off a day off (someone correct me please if I am wrong about that). This year however, the Suns play the Lakers AT STAPLES for the first two contests and both times we will be coming off a game the prior night while the Lakers will be coming off a day of rest. Pathetic! If that doesn't signal an NBA bias towards the Lakers I don't know what does!
Okay, I got that off my chest. Now to the game. I think the way the Lakers will approach this game defensively is that they will utilize KOBE on the defensive end in an attempt to shut down JRich. As much as I dislike the Lakers, I must admit that they are very well coached and prepared. They will know that JRich has been going off lately -- I think Jackson will direct Kobe to exert more of his energy on the defensive end in an attempt to LOCK DOWN on JRich. And as much as I hate Kobe, I must admit that when he puts his mind to it, he can be a lockdown defensive player. I've seen him do it against McGrady where Tracy couldn't even get a shot off for an entire quarter. If the Lakers choose to utilize Kobe in this way, it will be of primary importance that AMARE have a big game offensively , to compensate for what I see as potentially fewer points from JRich.
If I were Gentry I'd come out early with a heavy dose of pick and roll with Nash and Amare, and also direct Amare to attack the basket off the dribble in hopes of getting Bynum and Gasol (if he plays on Thurs, and it looks like he might) in early foul trouble. I think this is the Suns best chance of winning this game. Amare needs to have a big game offensively, and in particular, attacking the basket to get the two Laker bigs in foul trouble. I don't think Jackson will let us kill them with 3's the way we have been killing opponents on the road trip.
On the defensive end for the SUNS I think it will be important to run the Lakers off their 3 attempts and limit their second chance points.
If these things happen I can see the Suns winning on Thursday night. If, for some reason we don't then the next game on Dec. 6 becomes a must win, primarily for psychological reasons. Maybe I'm getting ahead of myself here, but in order to potentially beat the Lakers in the playoffs I think this team will need two things to have happened in the regular season, and one depends on the other: 1) I think we need to have HOME COURT advantage in a potential playoff matchup, and this means 2) We need to WIN the Pacific Division. This may seem like a tall order at this time, but we don't know what the season will bring. It will most certainly be difficult, but I don't think it is an impossibility.
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This is a game
where we could use Lopez to set some hard screens for JRich,
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Nov 10, 2009 12:37 PM MST reply actions 0 recs
I think he has not even peacticed yet.
I was just dreaming
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Nov 10, 2009 2:01 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
practiced, sorry
I just read an Allen Iverson article, and my fingers had trouble spelling the word.
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Nov 10, 2009 2:03 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
My pleasure, sir
http://blogs.hoopshype.com/blogs/lazenby/2009/11/08/redemption-is-still-possible/
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Nov 11, 2009 4:05 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
CMON GORAN!
i think this game comes down to our bench peformance. we really need Goran to pull through this game on Brown/Farmar. We can’t let Sasha catch fire,a nd we absolutely cannot let Lamar destroy us commanding the 2nd unit.
If our starters can somehow hold their starters from breaking away from us, we need the bench to come out ready and firing. I doubt kobe or artest would let JRich pop-off this game like he’s been doing
by vdub on Nov 10, 2009 2:07 PM MST reply actions 0 recs
This game.
Does come down to our bench production. And who cares about Kobe. Just like any other star on any other team. Play moderate defense on him. Lock down the rest of his team. He isnt going to score 108 points on anybody if you play moderate defense on him.
Our bench is also key. They will need to out hustle in every instance on every play.
Now this is where this game can get crazy out of hand. Pau Gasol and Andrew Bynum. If they are both playing we will have a hard time matching up with them and still having enough offense to compete with the inevitable scoring fest that they will bring. Every team gets amped up to play the Suns becuase they know there is a chance for fast fun basketball. The Lakers are no different and will expect to score 130 to win this game. We should maintain a goal of 105 to be competative. I think this game rides heavily on the inside scoring ability of the Lakers. It will be sort of what we saw in Orlando.
TO THE NBA - " Yeah, you have created a rift within me ; Now there have been ; several complications ; that have left me feeling nothing ; I might say, you were ; wrong to take it from me ; Left me feeling nothing " - Disturbed, "Numb"
by antiw0rm on Nov 10, 2009 8:27 PM MST reply actions 0 recs
Meant to say keep the Lakers to 105pts.
TO THE NBA - " Yeah, you have created a rift within me ; Now there have been ; several complications ; that have left me feeling nothing ; I might say, you were ; wrong to take it from me ; Left me feeling nothing " - Disturbed, "Numb"
by antiw0rm on Nov 10, 2009 8:30 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
I just heard a couple of hours back
that PAUL GASOL is unlikely to play. Along the lines of what you’re saying this should help the Suns chances in the game.
by Jack Frost on Nov 10, 2009 10:12 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Conspiracy
I do not think it was a conspiracy or something by the NBA. Before the season when the schedule was being made no one (outside of the Suns faithful) seriously expected the suns to challenge the Lakers for the Pacific crown, most expected us to barely make or miss the playoffs. It is still early but we are so far hugely beating those expectations.
by eagleheart on Nov 11, 2009 2:39 AM MST reply actions 0 recs
Well, I didn't call it a conspiracy......
I simply said this kind of scheduling signals an “NBA bias towards the Lakers.” And I wholeheartedly stand by that statement. It doesn’t mean the Lakers aren’t a very good team etc.. it just means they are being given a competitive advantage by the League schedule makers. You can make of it what you will, but to have not just the first, but the second matchup, less than a month later, with the exact same conditions is completely unjustified and reeks of a league bias.
How else would you explain that decision eagleheart? Everyone knows that NBA teams almost universally have a poorer record on the 2nd night of back to back than in games coming off a day or more of rest, and, especially when the 2nd night is a road game…
I’d like to hear others thoughts on this as well, cause to me it is significant.
by Jack Frost on Nov 11, 2009 8:34 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
We are the Lakers only competition in the Pacific and they are ours… so it really does make you stop and think.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 11, 2009 9:20 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Stop and think that the Lakers have their 2nd of a back to back on friday, against a team that made the WCF.
by wondahbap on Nov 11, 2009 7:33 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Do you
Actually think the scheduling fiends thought this year’s Phoenix Suns team would be a tough match up for their Champion Lakers on the front end of their back2back?
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 11, 2009 7:54 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
YES, I do.....
They know alot more than we do.
And you said it yourself earlier, the SUNS are the only real challenger to the Lakers in the Pacific.
by Jack Frost on Nov 12, 2009 10:18 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Do not forget
that “road” games for LAL against LAC are played in the same arena. It is only a few games a year but in the wild west, a few games can be the difference from 4th seed to 9th seed.
by Gorilla Game on Nov 12, 2009 11:47 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Blame Donald Sterling or Staples Center for allowing the Clips to be the Lakers' tenants.
Too bad the Clips would lose no matter where they played.
by wondahbap on Nov 12, 2009 11:49 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
You are Correct on the Clips losing.
Just the fact that its considered a road game when the time/distance spent traveling is the same as a home game.
Regardless, I am not too concerned about energy tonight with this game. If the Suns lose I will not freak, I just do not want a blowout loss. No matter this should be a good game.
by Gorilla Game on Nov 12, 2009 11:56 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
+1 Eagleheart
This year however, the Suns play the Lakers AT STAPLES for the first two contests and both times we will be coming off a game the prior night while the Lakers will be coming off a day of rest. Pathetic! If that doesn’t signal an NBA bias towards the Lakers I don’t know what does!
Jack Frost,
Eagleheart is correct about the Suns not being projected to compete, so there is no bias in that. Did you happen to notice that the Lakers have a game against the Nuggets in Denver on Friday? Their 2009 WCF opponent Denver Nuggets. There is no bias. I think you can figure out what I’m getting at
by wondahbap on Nov 11, 2009 7:31 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
That the League has Bias towards the Lakers AND Nuggets?
I kid, I kid…
PSN ID- presbot
by presbot on Nov 11, 2009 7:44 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Towards everyone but us
If we ever win a chip, it’ll be in spite of Stern
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Nov 12, 2009 7:30 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree about the Suns not being a tough match up....
Eutychus said it elsewhere, and I agree. WE are the Lakers chief competition in the Western Conference. And I repeat, we get them not just the first meeting but ALSO in the second meeting. How can that be justified? If it were only the first meeting you could call it the luck of the draw, but both games A) AT Los Angeles B) Lakers are rested more than one day C) Suns coming off game the night before.
I think one would really have to be stupid or at least have one’s head in the sand not to read something into this. I don’t really want to go into detail, but if I have to I will . Don’t get me started on the LAKERS and David Stern and the League Office. You don’t want to go there.
And who cares that the Lakers play Denver on Friday? They still have mutiple days rest before both of the first two Suns contests and it is Phoenix who they’ll battle for the Pacific Division, not the Nuggets.
by Jack Frost on Nov 11, 2009 8:16 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
I never said that the Suns wouln't be a tough match-up.
I agreed with Eagleheart that no one (outside of Suns fans) expected the Suns to be as good as they are right now.
And who cares that the Lakers play Denver on Friday? They still have mutiple days rest before both of the first two Suns contests and it is Phoenix who they’ll battle for the Pacific Division, not the Nuggets.
Everyone cares. The Nuggets made the WCF last year. It’s a nationally televised game because of that. If there is a bias for the Lakers scheduling the Suns, who weren’t expected to be legitimate Title contenders, then there must be a bias towards the Nuggets for letting them get the Lakers in Denver, in the 2nd game of a Lakers back-to-back.
There is no bias. Take a look at the Lakers Jan, Feb, and March schedules. Nothing comfortable about it. They are on the road during the meat of the season. Even if the NBA sets ups a tough schedule for a team, as you think they did for the Suns, then the team just has to deal with it. If the Suns are going to be the team you think they are, then they have to win on the road, at home, in back to backs, or on rest. Where and when shouldn’t matter. Being the team that can deal with it can. See?
by wondahbap on Nov 12, 2009 9:56 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
The Conference matters more than a division.
I didn’t come here to talk smack, but there will be no battle for the Pacific.
by wondahbap on Nov 12, 2009 9:58 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Smack
Tommorow will be a battle for the Pacific or haven’t you checked the standings lately son?
by eagleheart on Nov 12, 2009 10:09 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
HAHA
Why are we expecting a Lakers fan and an SSR spy to even care about anything other than whether or not LeBron is worthy to scrape gum off of the the bottom of Cryant’s shoes?
At least you cared enough about the Pacific to mosey on down to BSotS. Welcome. But don’t expect any sympathy for your poor Lakers and your weak defense of the League Bias for LALA land
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 12, 2009 10:11 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
FYI
This isn’t just some crazy conspiracy fabricated by fans… Alvin Gentry even alluded to some fishy biz-nass with his one..er two liner here in Coro’s blog:
The Suns arrived early Thursday in Los Angeles, where the Lakers have been resting since Sunday and got Andrew Bynum healed up. Phoenix had a weeklong road trip and one day off before a back-to-back.
“You don’t want me to get into that one,” Gentry said. “It’s on the schedule so we’ll play it. It just seems strange.”
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 12, 2009 10:24 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Thank you for that Eutychus
My comment below is directed to wondabap
by Jack Frost on Nov 12, 2009 10:37 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
On the road during the meat of the season......
Yes, every team has back to backs and every team has to deal with travelling challenges. I never said they didn’t.
My point is when and a what part of the schedule, and most importantly against WHOM
?
In my fanpost I put it in bold and highlights that it is the FIRST TWO MEETINGS. I did that because I think it is very significant. You talk about the ’meat" of the Laker schedule being difficult. Well, have you seen how friggin EASY the EARLY part of the schedule is for the Lakers. They play a huge majority of the early schedule at HOME.
I happen to be of the opinion that the early part of the season is tremendously important. It establishes who you are as a team and creates either a postive or negative mindset with the players. If the Lakers can use that incredibly easy schedule to build a big lead in the Division, then that is of huge significance. Just my view.
I also disagree that nobody could have foreseen the Suns being competitive. I think the League has a very good idea. I don’t choose to go into this argument at this time, but suffice to say that I DO NOT conceed that point that nobody knew they would be good. How the hell do you know that???
by Jack Frost on Nov 12, 2009 10:35 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Not just good.
Very good. They look very good right now. But you cannot tell me anyone outside of Phoenix fans thought you would get as much production from Channing Frye and Jared Dudley. Nor for Amare to play like he cared again.
You can’t tell me you expected 47% 3 pt. FG%.
by wondahbap on Nov 12, 2009 10:39 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Stop whining about it though.
If the Suns are for real, then it doesn’t matter.
Last year, the schedule makers set the 1st Boston game on Christmas. After a day layoff, following a 4 game in 5 days road trip. Then the 2nd game against Boston was the 2nd of a road back to back. The Lakers still won both. The Lakers were for real. No one complained about league bias.
Seriously. I visit all blogs when I link them before games. But I am surprised to see Suns fans sound like Boston fans.
Fact is, I’m glad the Suns are better. It makes for a better year, and better focus for #16. It was sad to see Shaq and Terry Porter kill your team. It’ll be much more fun. Have fun. Enjoy the game.
by wondahbap on Nov 12, 2009 10:52 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
But I am surprised to see Suns fans sound like Boston fans.
Because Lakers fans are the ideal… rrrriiiiggghhhhtttt
P.S. .. what does that even mean?
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 12, 2009 11:24 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
League wide bias for the Lakers or against the Suns.
Very Bostonian.
by wondahbap on Nov 12, 2009 11:47 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
rrrrriiiiggghhttttt
Well then it’s very interesting that everyone in the NBA but the Lakers fans feels that there is a bias for the Lakers…
I mean – from a bu$ine$$ $tandpoint… becau$e $tern doe$ run a bu$ine$$… it really wouldn’t make cent$ to pull $ome behind the $cene $tring$ that would kind of $ort of maybe benefit a little the team in the NBA with the large$t fan ba$e… I mean that is just non-cent$.
Especially since we’ve seen how the league really doesn’t care about money at all… it’s all about basketball and the love of real competition. That’s why they haven’t lowered or why they aren’t talking about lowering the team salary cap so as to force teams to pay more money in over-the-cap fees… or that’s why they aren’t handing out 15, 25, 50, 35 thousand dollar fines like Halloween candy to anyone who speaks out of line… I mean, the refs are very happy with how they’re being compensated by the league and all… and the economy is doing so great right now that there would be no reason for $tern to weasel a consistent profit out of his business.
I’m a misguided Suns fan.. sorry to offend your amazingness.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 12, 2009 2:30 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
I guess wondahbap is done Trolling..
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 12, 2009 4:19 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Trolling is for the uninformed.
Just because I don’t orange doesn’t make me a troll. Only trolls are threatened by opposing views. I’m sorry you’re threatened by a Lakers fan. You should work on that.
by wondahbap on Nov 12, 2009 5:14 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Only trolls are threatened by opposing views
??? I must have missed that chapter in the trolling manual.
By your own rule – you are the visitor who felt moved to respond, or maybe you could say threatened by what was being said in this fan post. I’m supplying quality reasoning for the positions I take. You respond with empty inflammatory posts like “Stop whining about it…” “Surprised to see Suns fans sound like Boston fans” … “Bitter” .. “you are a fool” etc.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 12, 2009 7:00 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Not threatened.
I’m always down for a debate or conversation about basketball. I disagree with you all. So, you call it trolling.
by wondahbap on Nov 13, 2009 7:36 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
I am threatened by Lakers fans,
most of them are packing heat :^)
by Gorilla Game on Nov 13, 2009 10:34 AM MST up reply actions 1 recs
Or Washington Bullett fans
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Nov 13, 2009 12:00 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Trust me.
I can play the conspiracy theory game better than you. Of course a league should protect it’s own pockets. But the scheduling of these games don’t fit into that conspiracy or bias. Even if the NBA did set the Lakers up for a nice start, the Lakers still have to get it done, just like the Suns would have to prove they are good enough to overcome the circumstances following back to backs. This is professional sports. When the money is on the line, you have to get it done. Any good team will have their chances.
If you think the NBA is fixed, then you are a fool for watching. Any pro league should follow the story lines and public interest, but it is still up to the teams to get it done when their numbers called. Suns? Never could. Fans? Bitter.
by wondahbap on Nov 12, 2009 5:21 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Good one
It’s against my religion to trust Laker fans. Sorry.
So let me get this straight -
1) You don’t refute that there is a scheduling bias. In fact – by ranting about ‘getting it done’ you admit that there is one.
2) You assert that the Laker friendly scheduling, which you admit exists, doesn’t fit a financial agenda for the league… but you don’t say how it doesn’t when all fingers point to the fact that it does.
3) You fabricate an accusation that I think the NBA is fixed. I never said that. Nobody said that. Bias from the League and Bias from the officials is not the same as fixing games. I’m surprised you didn’t know that. Oh wait. I’m not.
But you’re right – you are WAY better at this conspiracy theory game.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 12, 2009 6:52 PM MST up reply actions 0 recs
1.) I never admitted there was a scheduling bias.
I said, if there was one, the teams still have to be good enough to follow through.
2.) Yes. The Lakers early schedule is cushy. That doesn’t not mean there is a scheduling bias. The back to back issue some of you are having with the scheduling of last night’s game, is the same scenario the Lakers are put in tonight against their 2009 WCF foe. The same scheduling every team is getting this year.
As home friendly as the early part of LA’s schedule is, Jan, Feb, and March are road heavy. At a point when teams are gelling, there is nothing friendly about that. Especially for defending Champs. Plus, Staples Center has a lot of other events, plus another NBA team to schedule. That factors in.
If you still feel there is a bias in the schedule (and I can’t convince you), then to the Victor goes the spoils.
3.) Bias from the NBA is fixing, to a degree. Not to the extent of corrupt officiating, but it is.
I will admit that I share some extent of bias for good business reasons. For example, the Jazz seem to get a very favorable whistle at home. Is that wrong? No. Opposing team just have to be professionals and adjust. Play through it. Just like schedules.
by wondahbap on Nov 13, 2009 8:36 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
You won't convince anybody here. Period.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 13, 2009 10:20 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
I’m surprised you didn’t know that… oh wait. You guessed it. I’m not.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 13, 2009 10:20 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
damn, I cann’t reply in the right place, but thx Hawk42
by matrix7 on Nov 12, 2009 5:27 AM MST reply actions 0 recs
I caught it
you’re welcome
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
by Hawk42 on Nov 12, 2009 7:30 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
Someone famous once said
“You have to be good enough to beat three people. Yourself, the other team, and the referee.” If we want to win this game and others like we just have to be good enough. Or should I say great enough
by Suns Fan For Life on Nov 12, 2009 12:02 PM MST reply actions 0 recs
NBA Bias fixed or not?
I think maybe it doesn’t matter too much if there was a conspiracy or not.
It is better to get a lousy schedule early in the season than at the end of the season.
by eagleheart on Nov 13, 2009 2:22 AM MST reply actions 0 recs
What are you doing here?
First, You don’t know what you’re talking about. And even if you did, that doesn’t mean you’r not a troll. You are here to provoke people.
I don’t go to Laker boards and write inflammatory comments.
You grow up and go home you bleeping troll.
by Jack Frost on Nov 13, 2009 10:03 AM MST reply actions 0 recs
I'm done with him
He’s not even making it fun. No concrete arguments. They are comparable to an elementary school boy’s automatic playground argument retort of… “SO….. er.. YOU ARE…”
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
by Eutychus on Nov 13, 2009 10:27 AM MST up reply actions 0 recs
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