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Amare Stoudemire...the ride continues

Amare Stoudemire blocks Dwight Howard...

Amare Stoudemire blocks Dwight Howard...

Amare Stoudemire. The name itself can bring feelings of disappointment to some and excitement to others. Amare is an enigma, a seemingly impossible riddle with a surprisingly simple solution. Since he fell to the Suns in the 2002 NBA draft, no player has taken Suns fans from the brink of ecstasy to the brink of insanity quite like Amare. We fell in love with his rim-rattling dunks and sheer power around the rim in his rookie season and our love only grew as he nearly carried the Suns past the Spurs in Steve Nash's first year back with the team. We mourned his loss when he went down to the dreaded microfracture surgery the next summer. We got our hopes up when he came back with a monster first game in the middle of the following season only to be heartbroken when news broke that he was shutting it down 2 games later. We were loving life as he played his way to a First Team All NBA nod the following year (a completely unprecedented comeback from the surgery) only to sit in disbelief as Stern's goons came down with the ruling that he was to miss a game because he stepped on the court against (who else) the Spurs. Throughout the 26 year olds' career we have applauded him for his strengths and crucified him for his weaknesses. We have demanded the best from him even to the point of (however unfairly) demanding a title and when those demands were ultimately met with disappointment, many fans clamored for the higher ups to give us his head on a platter.


As the conversation heats up as to what the Suns should do this off-season, allow me to show you why Amare Stoudemire should at all costs be in a Suns uniform this coming season. As a disclaimer I will say that I do not know the full extent of Amare's eye injury or what affects that might have on him this season but I'm hoping for the best as I write this.

Star-divide

Amare wants to get paid
It is no secret that Amare Stoudemire wants to be thought of (and paid) as a top player in this league. He is not the first and he certainly won't be the last athlete to think like this. Now, the easiest way to get paid in any sport is to remind those with the money what you're worth before going to them and asking for it. That's exactly how Rashard Lewis got paid $60 million to be the third option on the Magic and how Gilbert Arenas has managed to sign big contracts with the Wizards. Amare Stoudemire is in a contract year and if you don't think that he is aware of that fact (or that his agent is repeatedly reminding him of it) you are sorely mistaken. As Ricky Bobby puts it, Amare is playing for keeps. That being said, if I were the Suns I would be VERY reluctant to give away a motivated Amare and his expiring contract this season.

Amare is one of the top 6 scorers in this league
This is something that I think Suns fans tend to take for granted or just overlook altogether. Maybe they're under the impression that it is easy to score in the NBA or maybe they just don't know the beauty of a big man who has the perfect combination of touch and power around the rim and an accompanying midrange jumper. Either way, it is time to give Amare his due. Because of his unique skill set for a player his size, Amare is able to score almost at will on anyone in the league. He can overpower smaller defenders and extend himself out between 15 and 18' when bigger players are guarding him. In fact, given his size and skill set, I would say that Amare is one of the top 3 scorers when it comes to how much effort they have to give in order to score. For example, Kobe has the best offensive arsenal in the NBA but on any given night he is being guarded by someone who is just as strong, just as big and just as quick. This makes it a lot harder for him to get his points which is why you don't really hear of Kobe dropping a "quiet" 25 points - instead you have to settle for an out-of-this-world 81 point game. Either way you look at it, right now I would contend that the top 6 scorers in this league are (in no particular order) LBJ, Kobe, Melo, Amare, Dirk and DWade. Why does this matter? Remember how many close games we lost after Amare went down for the end of the season? You have to have a scorer who can get his at the end of games - Amare Stoudemire is that player and I would even contend that had he not gone down, the Suns would have been in the playoffs. Amare's absence hurt more than most are willing to let on and if we give him away this offseason we will regret it as we are struggling to close out close games next season. Nash is able to hit the big shots but it is a lot harder for him to score and carry the Suns for the last 2 minutes of a tight ballgame without the help of Amare - a consistent inside/outside scorer who can take the pressure off.

Amare CAN learn and CAN be a good defensive player
I have been saying for a while now that the Suns need to get rid of Shaquille O'Neal and bring in a defensive minded (veteran) center. Stoudemire has proven that he is willing to work hard to improve his game and to come back from injury. When he underwent microfracture surgery, many said that he would never be the same because nobody had ever come back from that injury the same. However, Amare did come back and actually came back better than he was when he left! Amare worked hard to hone his skills and add new ones. He came back with a better handle and went from being a dunker to a complete offensive player. Amare CAN use that same work ethic to develop his defensive game, too. He just needs somebody to show him HOW to play defense! For those who have given up on Amare already let me ask you this, who has he ever had to show him how to play good D in the league? Remember that he came into the league straight from HS and that the Suns have never had a player like a Marcus Camby or a Kevin Garnett to help him learn how to play the NBA defensive game. As a player with his size and speed there's no reason why he can't learn to be a good if not a great defensive player.

Now, for those of you thinking to yourselves that he's had time and should have learned by now, I submit to you three cases from the past two seasons.

Paul Pierce: An offensive force for years yet he never had the defensive tenacity necessary to take his game to superstar level until a certain player showed up and taught him. KG helped Pierce step up his game and become one of the best overall players in the league.

LeBron James: LBJ has been a special talent since he was in 7th grade. However, it took a summer with Kobe Bryant to transform him into the complete machine he has become on both sides of the ball.

Carmelo Anthony: Perhaps the biggest ray of hope for Amare, Melo was known for his defensive deficiencies much the same way Amare is. However, a summer with Kobe and half a season with Billups has turned Melo into a full-blown superstar. You could argue that he has played as well as anybody (except LBJ who has been just insanely good) during these playoffs and while he is not the defensive force James has become, he has made great strides in improving in that area - even asking for the assignment to guard Kobe during stretches of last night's game.

As a fan I have both loved and hated Amare - I have even called for a trade of Stoudemire in the past. That's what happens on roller coasters, you go up and then you go down. Ultimately, the ride ends and you get off satisfied. This ride is not over and it would be an absolute shame for the Suns to give up on Amare at this point. Say what you will about him, dude is a special player who is an absolute beast on the offensive end with the potential to be special on the defensive end as well. Amare Stoudemire needs to be in a Suns uniform for the '09 - '10 season...after all, you could be severely injured trying to jump off a roller coaster before it's come to a full and complete stop.

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great analysis. Now if we can just get Steve Kerr and our very own Stan to agree with you. Amar’e is just mixed up between all the system changes, coach changes, expectations from outside, his own ego and reality. these are hard to manage all at once, especially for someone who needs praise and confidence to play well

Once upon a time the Suns got out on the break... and along came Steve sucKerr

by Murcy on May 20, 2009 12:10 PM MDT reply actions   0 recs

Me?

I said just yesterday that the Suns would be better off waiting to see what Amare brings. I certainly got to the point last season with his unmotivated play that I was willing to trade him for the right deal. The right deal wasn’t there.

As for the Bulls trade, I put it out there but voted “not sold”. I think it illustrates about as good as you can hope for which isn’t horrible but isn’t great either.

The thing that worries me most about Amare’s ability to improve defensively is his b-ball IQ. I agree he’s put in a lot of effort to improve his game but it’s one thing to work on a mid-range jump shot and another to be able to guard the pick and roll.

I am even willing to over look that and just accept him as a defensively limited player with amazing offensive skills. If the effort is there on a consistent basis. Last season it wasn’t. Maybe w/ Gentry it will be – that’s the big question he needs to answer.

Assuming though that he comes back and starts the season looking great, I still question tying up $20m/yr for 5 or 6 yrs given his history. You could easily end up like the Rockets w/ T-Mac. Those huge long term contracts just scare the crap out of me. They can be a drag on a franchise for a long long time. That’s the risk which may be greater then the risk of letting him go.

I am clearly on the fence but leaning towards not extending him unless the numbers are more reasonable…$15m per year or so.

Think of it this way. Amare is better then David Lee but is he $10m or $12m per year better? That extra money will get you one or two very good players.

I am fine building around superstars but there are very few of those and paying a guy that isn’t like he is….that’s not good

by Seth Pollack on May 20, 2009 12:25 PM MDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed!

100% You just summed up everything I’ve been saying all along. But please allow me to go into slightly further detail on a few aspects.

Amare is greedy: Nobody likes a greedy person. But greedy people are some seriously hungry people and they’ll eat anyone or anything in their way. Amare will definately be chasing a big contract this season. Not just for an extention from the Suns, but to increase his trade value, should the Suns decide to swap.

Improving through Injury: Point was brought up about Amare developing his jumper while having the knee injury. Well, why is that? Put yourself in his shoes and see what happens. You’re a baller, completely love the game, but you cant move and just sit there watching the game. You are constantly holding a ball but cant run around and dunk. You start tossing the ball at the hoop instead of putting it straight through. You’ve now acquired a jump shot.
So what happens with an eye injury? You cant really do a damn thing. Having only one working eye and no depth perception makes basketball damn near impossible. But you can watch video! Sit and study your game, opponents’ game, and legendary players games. Look at what you do vs what everyone else does. When the eye heals, you better believe those videos are still imprinted in memory.

Amare CAN be a defensive player: Look, we know he’s not known for his amazing D. We’ve seen all too many times how lazy an unmotivated Amare can be. But we’ve all seen what a motivated Amare can do too. We talk about his monster dunks and smooth midrange jumper, but we forget that when dude is ontop of his game, he’s getting a nice amount of blocks too. Go to youtube and watch any Stoudemire mix; I guarantee they’ll show you some blocks that’ll make you say “ugh.”

Another thing I’ve said forever now is that Amare is Sho’Nuff from The Last Dragon. So you better bow down and kiss his converse. SHO’NUFF!!!

by KnowGood on May 20, 2009 12:10 PM MDT reply actions   0 recs

Amen brotha

I, like you have gone back and forth on the whole trade Amare thing. But, after a summer of pondering trade scenarious and Amare’s worth, i think it would be a big mistake to trade him. In fact, i think we do need to sign him to a max extension at this point. Listen, every team needs a go to guy. Every team needs a guy who can score in the clutch. Amare has “it”, and i think he could be that guy.

 You’re also correct about needing to replace Shaq with a center who can play D and has a spot-up jumper. Just like Kurt Thomas. I just dont see anyone taking him off our hands this year.
 
Then there’s Nash’s new comments about trying to get a raise. We can’t do it. So he’s around for one more year and then gone.

So my point is, we have one more year with this Amare, Shaq, Nash core. I like the idea of giving it another try, just to see what could happen. Then, said core is done. If we let Amare go at that point, then we are officially starting over, rebuilding, years and years away from contention again. And that would only be if we get lucky in the draft.

We NEED Amare if we want to stay competitive, and have short turnaround after the current core falls apart. After next year, we have to be active in finding a solid free agent so we can start a new core. Dwayne Wade would be, obviously, the best player we could get, but thats a pipe dream. I think though we can definitely get someone to come here that has some worth. And in a few years i think we can be competitive again

by Funky Flapsack on May 20, 2009 1:24 PM MDT reply actions   0 recs

CBA Question

My understanding is that the Suns can pay Amare more than anyone else can pay him if they re-sign during this period. Is that true?

If so, why can’t the Suns pay more than any other team is permitted to pay, but less than the max? Is that possible?

Mmmmm ... Guinness

by JSun on May 20, 2009 1:37 PM MDT reply actions   0 recs

From what I understand...

Once Amare’s contract is up, anyone can throw out offers but the Suns have the final say in whether or not they want to match (or bump it up). It really depends on what others are willing to pay. For instance, Joe Johnson was offered X amount by the Hawks and the Suns could have matched or raised but ultimately, after all the offers are on the table it’s the player’s decision as a free agent which offer they will take.

by watdogg10 on May 20, 2009 2:06 PM MDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think you're thinking about "restricted free agents"

Those you could match. But in Amar’e’s case, he will be an unrestricted free agent if he decides to opt out after the next season. Then he has the autonomy to take whichever offer he has.

With the 14th pick of the 2009 NBA draft, the Pheonix Suns select... 3 million dollars!

by gadogry on May 20, 2009 2:12 PM MDT up reply actions   0 recs

Under the current CBA

The Suns can offer Amare a 6 year contract, with 10% annual increase. Other teams can only offer 5 yr contracts with 8% annual increase. Since Amare has between 7-10 yrs of experience in the league, his starting salary is at most 30% of the cap.

But things like sign-and-trade can happen. Like Reshard Lewis’ agent somehow managed to make the Magic go through the trouble of doing a sign-and-trade: Lewis signs the 6-yr super max contract only Seattle could him, then trade him to Orlando.

But the CBA expires soon and by the time Amar’e signs another contract, it could be a totally different set of rules.

With the 14th pick of the 2009 NBA draft, the Pheonix Suns select... 3 million dollars!

by gadogry on May 20, 2009 2:10 PM MDT up reply actions   0 recs

Durant?

I’m pretty sure Durant belongs in the top scorers conversation and will probably top it in the next few years. Also, Amare is more dependent on others than Kobe, since he’s a big man so you probably shouldn’t compare apples to oranges, you know. But Amare, along with Yao and Dirk, is a premier interior scorer, which as you say is rare and valuable.

As far as Amare’s D is concerned, I would agree he can get better but let’s not forget he’s a grown man and a professional player. He shouldn’t need someone else to make him a good defensive player. True, another player or coach could help him but just because someone else can repair a short coming that is your fault doesn’t make that short coming any less your fault.

But yeah, since the Suns probably can’t get good value for him, don’t trade him.

However, something like Gay +no.2 pick for Amare? No brainer every day of the week. Won’t happen though, so Amare 09-10 por vida.

Purchasing my Dragic jersey

by rosewood on May 20, 2009 2:39 PM MDT reply actions   0 recs

Durant...

I would say Durant is 7th right now – that will probably change this year though if he continues to improve like he did last season.

If by more dependent you mean can’t bring the ball up the floor and needs someone to pass him the ball, then yes. But if Amare gets the ball anywhere 18’ and in he knows what to do to get the shot that he wants. And comparing who can score more effortlessly regardless of what position they play is not comparing apples to oranges. Like I said, it takes less effort for Amare to score against the players that guard him than it does for Kobe – don’t take that as me saying Amare is the better player by any means.

by watdogg10 on May 20, 2009 2:48 PM MDT up reply actions   0 recs

this is about scoring

Durant is a better pure scorer, though Roy – at this point – is a more complete player. But Durant can easily get stats like Marion in the year Amare was injured (crazy stats) only with even more scoring

Once upon a time the Suns got out on the break... and along came Steve sucKerr

by Murcy on May 21, 2009 11:53 AM MDT up reply actions   0 recs

Excellent post - it is on all the SBNation sites.

As a Bulls fan I am interested in Amare. A healthy Amare would fit perfectly with Derrick Rose. However buyer beware. Retinal tears are not easy to repair for the long-term. Amare may be fine but he may not be. We, the Bulls are still suffering the consequences of the Ben Wallace signing. We have one more year of carrying the remnants of Wallace’s salary via Jerome James who will not play because of injuries. Paying a player big money that doesn’t work out kills you for years. We were lucky to get Rose. Without Rose we were doomed for below mediocrity with very little chance to get better because of Wallace’s legacy. I would not want Amare straight up because I wouldn’t want the Bulls to sign him – it is too risky. I say this feeling a healthy Amare would be a great fit on the high screen-roll with Rose. Knowing you are in salary cap hell because of a poor performing highly paid player takes the heart out of a team.

by chgobr on May 20, 2009 5:04 PM MDT reply actions   0 recs

The problem is that he CAN'T score on anyone at will.

Put him in the post by himself without Nash setting him up and he has absolutely no idea what to do. He can’t blow by people for the easy dunk anymore b/c he lost his first step after microfracture, which is why he’s become increasingly reliant on his (admittedly beautiful) jumpshot, to a tune of 54% of his attempts being jumpshots.

I love Amare’s scoring, but Amare without Nash is simply not a maximum player.

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on May 20, 2009 6:32 PM MDT reply actions   0 recs

Paul Piece, like Ray Allen, probably improved because of the Boston system. But I don’t think he was a bad defensive player before. But remember, there’s his Thobideau (?, what’s his name) sytem. This playoffs, without KG, they seem to be an average defensive team

Melo – I think he’s a different case. He always seems to have the potential, but held back by Iverson’s partying and anti-establishment attitude. Melo showed last year in team USA that he can play defense, it wasn’t because of Big Shot.

LBJ – I think this guy is really really special.

 If the argument is:

insert defensive player = diffusion of skills

It might be because had the talent all along. And also, I think ever since he was drafted, he’s always been good defensively, not as good as he is now, but still good. His transformation with Kobe, I believe, focused on his offensive skills. (his jump shot and three point shot that’s always been criticize).

by Azrael on May 20, 2009 8:26 PM MDT reply actions   0 recs

Potential being the key word

I’m not saying that the same thing will happen with Amare – I’m saying you can’t write him off unitl he’s given that same opportunity. Melo has NEVER been known as a defensive player – go back and he was as big of a defensive liability as Amare is sometimes that’s why everyone was going crazy when Denver traded Marcus Camby because he made up for a lot of Melo’s mistakes.

If you don’t think Kobe had something to do with teaching LBJ and Melo to play both sides of the ball with the same passion you are sorely mistaken. Just hanging out and practicing with somebody is not going to improve your shot – seeing how another player dedicates himself on the defensive end (especially when you are measuring yourself against that player a la LBJ and Kobe) is going to make you want to show that same dedication. Believe me, LBJ is not an All-NBA Defensive player without his being with Kobe and seeing his work ethic on both sides of the ball.

by watdogg10 on May 21, 2009 7:19 AM MDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hate listening to interviews with Stoudemire. He’s one of those guys that always brings the conversation back to him, and everything’s an advertisement for him somehow. Every interview makes me want to trade him all over again.

by jburning on May 21, 2009 8:34 AM MDT reply actions   0 recs

I just dont know...

I am so conflicted right now. A week ago we were, for the most part, all happy and ready to get our 14th pick keep the core and try another run. Now we are saying trade Amare and Nash. Cmon people. We have to be a little more loyal to our players. Especially Nash. HE has given us so much over the last few years. Amare as well, to some extent. I understand the lingering issues with Amare but they mostly boil down to his attitude (as unfortunately displayed in this interview). If Amare were as good as he is now but had the attitude of, say, a Lamar Odom or even Kurt Thomas – quiet, unassuming, humble to some degree, then we wouldnt be having this conversation. We would just say, “cmon Amare you need to get better, go do it!”
As for Nash, I think we need to give the guy some more credit than we are. I am trying to be open minded about this but I cannot see how we could possibly get anything good by trading him. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. He’s Basketball’s golden boy and a great talent. To trade him would be the worst decision this organization has ever made including the Joe Johnson fiasco. I think we have to be willing to step back a little bit and think some more on what we need as a team and be realistic about the fact that we are in the same boat as many other teams in the league right now.

Go read a book!

by N8lol on May 21, 2009 8:57 AM MDT reply actions   0 recs

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