Why the Suns Should Keep Shaq Happy
by JSun on May 26, 2009 2:03 PM MDT
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PrintWhile we're all daydreaming and floating off-season moves ... I've got a thought for next year. Just a random observation that one would throw out at happy hour while watching other teams put on their shows.
Don't D-Wade and Shaq still get along well? That's what I hear from the reports.
I don't know, but I can't believe that Wade is too happy with his situation in Miami right now.
When 2010 comes around, won't Wade be availble?
Would a move from Miami to Phoenix be unthinkable? If so, could we get Shaq to put in a good word for the Suns?
If it were even possible, could Amare co-exist with him? If Nash were around, would Wade let Nash handle the ball and set him up? It might be nice.
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I doubt we will have enough cap space to afford
Wade, Amare, Nash, and Shaq. We also have J. Rich’s huge contract to worry about and putting together a decent bench. When Amare was healthy and playing with Shaq they were both whining about not getting enough touches and it would just make things worse adding a player like Wade, whom take a lot of shot too.
Unless
he signed for a Grant Hill like minimum contract for his final year or two
Blogging Suns Basketball
by Seth Pollack on May 26, 2009 5:47 PM MDT up reply actions
yeah...
…not thinking that one is going to happen.
by Trevor Paxton on May 27, 2009 3:03 AM MDT up reply actions
That's some outside the box thinking.
I also think it’s outside the realm of possibility. I’m not sure Wade will be able to walk under his own power in a year. And that’s a lot of money depending on the Suns payroll situation. But I like it. Let’s be nice to the big guy.
You mean
the team should be nice to him right? We don’t have to. Do we?
Blogging Suns Basketball
by Seth Pollack on May 26, 2009 4:50 PM MDT up reply actions
i like
As far as there being too many mouths to feed, I just gotta say, im not buying it. Take the Celtics. You had Garnett, Allen, and Pierce in the starting lineup. Not to mention 2 good scorers in Rondo and Perkins. And it worked because they had great chemistry on the court. And Garnett was an amazing defender. So that excuse is tired.
As far as the idea of signing D-Wade, I absolutely love it. Problem is, if you’re Dwayne Wade, do you really want to move from the beautiful beaches of Miami to the smoldering heat of Phoenix? Now, if at that point we can offer him a more competitive team than Miami, then maybe. We would have to trade J-Rich, Sign Nash to less money, Re-sign Shaq, and not give Amare a max deal. But Maybe it’ll work
Smoldering heat of Phoenix?
Not during basketball season baby!
Blogging Suns Basketball
by Seth Pollack on May 26, 2009 5:48 PM MDT up reply actions
he has his nights.
he can be a good scorer if he needs to be. he just doesn’t get many touches, due to the other four people in the starting lineup.
by Trevor Paxton on May 27, 2009 3:05 AM MDT up reply actions
Is Wade worth a max contract?
There’s no doubt he is ability-wise, but, to me, that’s a lot of money to invest in a player who has a substantial injury history. Plus his game relies heavily on his athleticism (he is an undersized SG) and any loss of athleticism from persistent injuries could have a magnified effect upon his game.
I can’t say I’d be mad if the Suns signed Wade to that kind of money (I actually love Wade), but I would have a heightened worry about an Arenas or worse Allan Houston situation if we did sign him.
Purchasing my Dragic jersey
Agreed on the injury scare
I’m more worried about a signing like Tom Gugliotta or Penny Hardaway — you don’t need to go to other teams to bring up scary scenarios.
I’m just saying that IF Amare was still around (and not sore that a bigger superstar came into town) and Nash was passing the ball, he would not have to be the sole focus of the offense. Look how that can tire you out — look at LeBron and Kobe. I think that’s part of his problem, and I think that is why moving to a team like Phoenix (or any competitive team that could use a 2-guard) might be attractive.
When I look at the list of 2010 free agents, I don’t see anyone else making the move to the P-H-X. All that cap space may go to another bunch of hustling role-players that can’t catch the ball.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
Wade's definitely worth the max, but no way he chooses PHX over NYK or CHI
As far as their relationship….http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdHF215m7w8
Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."
Wade and Rose together?
Wow…talk about back court 2010!
Blogging Suns Basketball
by Seth Pollack on May 26, 2009 10:05 PM MDT up reply actions
Lol well, Rose should have belonged to the Heat anyway
Remember, the Heat had, by a substantial margin, the runaway worse record in the league last season. Somehow, the Bulls did a Portland and stole the no.1 pick from the poor, impoverished lottery team that Miami was =( It should originally have been Rose- Wade backcourt 2009 anyway. I can remember I was really looking forward to seeing that young backcourt rip through the Eastern Conference.
Why would you want Wade anyway??
That bum had more turnovers than Nash, last season. And he’s always injured.
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on May 28, 2009 4:41 PM MDT reply actions
You do realize I was being sarcastic....
Still, Wade has always been turnover prone. And I never hear criticisms about that little fact..
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on May 29, 2009 12:38 PM MDT up reply actions
true, but he was still trying too hard because he had to
probably why it’s not criticised as much
he’s not the brilliant passer that Nash is … so, it is more acceptable from him and less so from Nash
Mmmmm ... Guinness
it's less acceptable, because he handles the ball less..
A significant number of Nash’s turnovers come from passes the recipient has been unable to control. Normally you’d say that was Nash’s fault, but since he’s only made the top 10 in turnovers since returning to the Suns, I’d suggest his targets have a lot to do with that increase.
Stockton was top 10 in turnovers in 8 seasons (and is #2 all time, Karl Malone being #1), so turnovers come with the responsibility of being the playmaker. Which is why Assists/Turnovers is a more meaningful stat.
I just think it’s a hypocrisy for people to criticize Nash for something they’re not prepared to criticize in other players, just because they happen to like those other players more, or because they’ve bought into whatever hype surrounds that other player.
For active players, Kobe, Shaq, AI, Kidd and Garnett all have more total turnovers during their careers, and Tim Duncan is only 40 and Paul Pierce 45 turnovers behind Steve. I have never seen those players criticized once for their propensity to turnover the ball.
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on May 29, 2009 2:11 PM MDT up reply actions
I'm not talking about handling, I'm talking about passing
Wade is forced to be a playmaker and a finisher. He’s merely an above-average playmaker being forced to make plays beyond his ability to do so.
The reason Nash gets so much more criticism is because we expect so much more out of him. I’m not saying its fair or rational … I’m just saying it is.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
you have to handle the ball before you can pass the ball.
as opposed to having handle, which is different.
but you made my point for me, which is that Wade isn’t as good as the media would have you believe. His tendency to turnover the ball, despite it being in his hands for less time, would actually reinforce that.
I think it is somewhat necessary to highlight that fact for those people who want to trade Nash, so we can get Wade, presumably (from the talk in this forum) to replace him.
I don’t blame Wade one bit, for this, btw. I think he’s a good player, but he’s not the next Jordan, the press seems desperate to find.
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on May 29, 2009 2:38 PM MDT up reply actions
I don't think
trading Nash for Wade would be the answer. I hope I didn’t suggest that; I’m pretty sure the daydream had Nash and Wade in the backcourt. the team would likely get worse in a Nash-Wade swap.
I agree the ball is in his hands way too much, but that’s simply because of the type of guy he is. I think we agree. Where I think we may disagree is that you’re saying Wade is over-rated and pointing out his flaws; I’m saying he’s being asked to do way too much with way too little around him and that is exacerabating his flaws.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
If you're good enough, then you can deal with it..
if he can’t handle the ball, then he shouldn’t be asked to, nor should he take on the responsibility of being a playmaker. In the immortal words of Client Eastwood" “A man’s gotta know his limitations”, and it’s his responsibility not to let his ego get in the way of his team’s success.
Fundamentally, all I’m saying, and I’m not accusing you of this, is that players get categorized, by the fans and the press, to fit an NBA archetype, the most common one being Jordan (Magic, Bird, Stockton, and many others come to mind).
It’s a problem I have with the media, and consequently with some fans, because it’s a symptom of lazy reporting, and betrays a swallow and facile understanding of the game.
So when I say Dwyane Wade is overrated, what I mean is that he’s been built up, by the media, to be the next Jordan, which is a game he’s not capable of playing. His game is different.
And by Jordan, I mean the mythological Jordan that exists in the media, and not the actual Jordan, who is the best player I ever saw live, but who also most certainly had his shortcomings, and most of them covered by Scottie Pippen.
I certainly think Wade is a very good player. But I think I’ve only seen a few all-star caliber players who were better than my perception of the hype, and they would be Duncan, Sabonis, Pippen, Rodman, Olajuwon, and Nash, one player, LeBron James, to be equal to the hype, and everybody else not quite as good (Jordan is in this category, because he was merely superhuman, as opposed to being godlike).
"True glory consists of doing what deserves to be written, and writing what deserves to be read".
by Pliny the Elder on May 29, 2009 4:25 PM MDT up reply actions
This is where we disagree (minor point) on Wade
I think he is capable of playing within his limitations but, right now, he cannot limit his game in his current situation in Miami and still give his team a chance. I don’t think it’s an ego issue — it’s more of a tragic hero knowing that he’s going to lose but still making the best move for the team at the time.
Wade over-handling the ball the Miami is better than letting the other D-Leaguers get their greasy paws on it and turn it over even more. Take the primary play-making responsibility out of his hands (or, give him someone in the low post that can demand double-teams and pass effectively) and he’s free to do what he is good and and be a more effective, and efficient, player.
Mmmmm ... Guinness
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