Jazz too Loud for Dragic, Suns: 124-115
As A Suns fan, you must have seen this one coming, right? Goran Dragic notching a second straight career high with 32 points, the Suns collectively shooting 17-30 from behind the arc, a 45 point second quarter, Steve Nash with 15 points and 15 assists, the Suns bench putting up 62 points... A Suns lead of 96-79 with 2 something left in the third quarter. That's a 17 point lead in Utah. Then a 12-0 point run by the Jazz to end the third and a 19 point 4th quarter and...Jazz 124 Suns 115. Yeah, you saw it coming, another double digit lead, another Suns loss. Stupid bipolar season...
Many of us are past the wins and losses now. And for us, it was great to see Goran go for 32 points off of 10-13 shooting, 6-7 from three point range. I'm going to go out on a limb and say I think this kid will be OK. He is tenacious, he is athletic, he is able, he is young. He may not be a Steve Nash clone, but I do not think Goran Dragic is a bust. In fact I think he will work out just fine as the heir apparent to Nash.
It was also great to see Channing Frye make some shots, coming up with 21 points off the bench on 8-15 shooting (5-10 from three point range). While we're on the bright side, congrats to Steve Nash on his 15/15/5 effort and becoming the 8th player in NBA history to reach 8,000 assists.
OK, if you're still counting wins and losses, here's the real story:
The Suns started slow, had a huge second quarter and once again blew a double digit lead. "We were up 17. We've got to be able to maintain that," said Alvin Gentry.
The man states the truth, but the sentiment rings hollow. Yes, the Suns should in theory, be able to maintain a 17 point lead and win a game. But theory is one thing, and this season is another. The Suns made only 7 of their final 24 field goal attempts in the game and lost. It was ugly, it was infuriating, it was typical.
Even after losing momentum and watching their 11 point lead dwindle to 5 in the third quarter and soon thereafter losing it for good at the 7 minute mark of the 4th, Phoenix still had a chance with 5 minutes left and the score tied. But the Jazz scored on 7 consecutive trips down the floor. The Suns could not answer, committing 2 turnovers and missing 6 of their next 10 field goals. Utah spread the love around, as Wesley Matthews, Andrei Kirilenko, Carlos Boozer, Paul Millsap, and Deron Williams all hit shots to ice the victory for the Jazz.
Worth Bulleting:
- Wesley Matthews came up big for the Jazz with 21 points 5 assists, and 4 rebounds, including 10 4th quarter points.
- Carlos Boozer had a huge game, with 21 points and 20 rebounds.
- The Suns shot 8-11 from three point range in the second period with Frosty and Frye doing most of the damage.
- Andrei Kirilenko had 25 points, 6 rebounds, 3 blocked shots, 2 assists and one steal.
- The Suns bench went 22-39 from the field and 12-20 from three point range
- Amare Stoudemire finished 16 and 5 on 4-12 shooting.
- Jason Richardson was so upset with the loss, he ate fried chicken on the plane (as quoted by Jared Dudley's tweet).
Quotable:
Goran Dragic:
"I felt like I could score every shot that I threw in. I'm not used to playing so many minutes. My legs were really heavy in the second half."
Steve Nash:
"We just couldn't get into our offense. They pushed us out. We had no penetration and we were just jacking up shots or turning it over."
"Ever since we were 14-3, that's been the story of the Phoenix Suns - big leads given away and lose."
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Goran still is what every knew he was. Two games doesn’t make a season. He has developed a jumpshot this year like everyone could see earlier in the year.
What did impress me was his agressiveness though. When he saw openings he attacked which I loved to watch. I hope he can be consistent with that and work on his true point guard skills a little bit(ball handling, decision making, basically limiting turnovers over the course of a season).
he's playing with confidence and even some swagger
He’s still very young and not ready to be a starting point guard in this league. It is the hardest position on the floor and he certainly has plenty of room for improvement.
I am confident he can become a starting caliber point guard but not certain. He could be more like a Kirk Hinrich type that plays both the 1 and 2 at times.
Still, he’s a 46th pick and the Suns saw something in him no one else did and they clearly were right.
So who knows what his upside is but for now, its fun watching him play like this just like it was fun watching LB develop from his first year when he was pretty much a disaster.
We do know he’s not a bust. We do know he can help the team. Until Nash misses several games in a row, we won’t know how far he’s come and how far he’s got to go.
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @sethpo
by Seth Pollack on Jan 26, 2010 9:40 AM MST up reply actions
hmmmm
the knicks? yes. Maybe Miami. Maybe. Indy, yes. The Wizards w/o Arenas – maybe
I still think that kind of extended play would expose him like most young players but he’s progressing in the right direction.
These last two or three games he’s recognized that the team’s needed him to be aggressive. He took over the Nets game in the 4th and of course the Warriors and now Jazz.
That’s progress
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @sethpo
by Seth Pollack on Jan 26, 2010 9:52 AM MST up reply actions
That is misleading
It’s obvious that Terry Porter did not provide the coaching and leadership Dragic needed to exercise even a respectable portion of his potential. Take a look at the percentage variances in Dragic’s shooting numbers under the two coaches last year.

Those are very respectable rookie shooting numbers under A.G, especially given his circumstance.
Here are some of the first round rookie’s this year and their Percentages (keep in mind that most of these guys have starting roles or play at least 30 minutes a game, whereas Dragic only averaged around 13 minutes last year).
(i’ll put the FG% first, then the 3pt%)
Jonny Flynn = .423/.339
Brandon Jennings = .383/.391
Stephen Curry = .455/.436 (touted as a pure shooter, which he is)
Tyreke Evans = .460/.259
Ty Lawson = .498/.433 (awesome rookie shooting numbers)
What is Dragic shooting now? .473/.421 which brings up his Career averages now to .438/.404. Those are good number for a point/combo guard… (JRIch this year? .457/.368)
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
I stand corrected...
I guess you can pin that on Porter
by Superelkman on Jan 26, 2010 11:11 AM MST up reply actions
If Kerr has any sense at all as a GM
he’ll be on the phone to Cleveland and Philly trying to work up a three team deal netting us iguodala and speights (or hickson), getting cleveland STAT and Philly the cap relief they want in Ilgauskas’ contract, i’d even take back a year of dalembert to get iggy.
So
the Sixers give up both Iggy and Speights for what? Hickson? or Ilgauskas? The trade ideas are getting alittle nuts around here.
No the sixers give up iggy and speights for cap relief.
obviously from a basketball perspective its a nuts trade for them to do, but thats the price to pay for signing elton brand to a stupid deal. If they can’t move dalembert or brand then they’ve consigned themselves to the fact that they have to move iggy to get cap relief, they waive ilgauskas and thats what they get.
What cap relief?
They give up 13, get 13. Unless they by out Z for penny on the dollar (no chance) they lose.
Terrible trade!
Yeah if Kerr has any sense as a GM
He’ll make absolute steals of deals that only benefit the Suns and do absolutely nothing for our trade partners.
by hcblankscreen on Jan 26, 2010 10:22 AM MST up reply actions
The trade machine is getting old
real fast. I want the Suns to trade Amare, however the sweetheart deal everyone expect to get I just don’t think will happen. I do believe teams know the situation with Amare’s contract, and the possibility that he can walk away from a contract next year makes a favorable deal for the Suns less likely.
I believe the Suns should count there lucky stars if they get a first round pick, cap relief and one serviceable player.
Gibson, Miller and the Bulls No. 1. Bulls might not part with Gibson, so the Suns might have to take Thomas.
+1
I cannot even speculate what the “package” will be, but I’m preparing myself to be confused and or disappointed.
I think Kerr may delay this for as long as possible because the fan backlash is going to be pretty bad.
Of course, it would be worse if this team was playing consistently good basketball.
Starting 14-3 was probably the worst thing that could have happened to the Phoenix Suns this season.
Blogging Suns Basketball. Twitter: @willcantrellphx
by Wil Cantrell on Jan 26, 2010 8:36 AM MST up reply actions
Agree about the start being a bad thing.
There are still fans calling this crappy play a “slump.” When you’ve spent one month going 14-3 and two months going something like 12-19, well, I think we know what team we’re dealing with. Would have been better if the Suns had just won 3 out of every 5 from the beginning.
Horrible Loss
This loss was absolutely terrible to watch. I knew this would happen as you are probably going to lose if you are only up 11 when you make 9 3’s in a half.
Same old Suns. They are just content hoping they outshoot the other team. We need a couple attitude guys that just want to come in play defense and bash the other team around a bit.
Not only defense
but they need to stop taking 3’s and jump shots when they have extended leads. Everything should be taken to the hole – either get a high % shot or take a trip to the line. I sound like a broken record to my friends and I’ve even written this a few times here but it really is an issue of complacency (like Wolf on 620 argues) with this team.
They get a lead and they become complacent. For whatever reason they feel justified in trying to stand out on the perimeter and run the clock down, and then try to chuck up a jump shot. The truth is – not only does our defensive consciousness take a nose dive when we give up these huge leads – but our offense stagnates as well and it’s because of this. Take it to the rim Frye. Take it to the rim JRich. Take it to the rim STAT. Take it to the *&^&$%$%&^#& rim SOMEBODY!
This team’s fatuous and recidivistic charades are anathema to me. (Yes Wil, I feel more important now)
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
well, you saw frye take it to the rim and he was fouled or something but there was no call.
by kuato lives on Jan 26, 2010 10:25 AM MST up reply actions
The Suns need to just get used to it.
It is no news flash to anyone that the Phoenix Suns aren’t given the red carpet treatment by the refs.
But if you keep taking it to the rim – they will have to call something eventually.
That is another potential gripe of last night – The game was not officiated consistently. Not to mention 5 fouls on Steve Nash (I especially loved the piggy back ride AK47 took on Nash… who was blown for the infraction)? Riiiiigghhhtt. During the first 2.5 quarters of the game it seemed like a player needed to bleeding in order to get a foul called. Then magically every little touch and bump was a foul.
I hate the officiating. It ruins the NBA, but nothing will change and I’m not giving up my fan-hood because of it – There comes a point when we as fans and the Suns as players need to figure that all into our game preparation. I feel like the Suns worried too much about the bad calls. Again we need to just shut up and put up, there is no one in stripes that is on our side – take it to the hole and bleed if you have to.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
NBA Officiating
The officials in the NBA aren’t the greatest… no one is going to deny that but they overall do an OK job. I think a youth movement, a revised official review process(how they evaluate the officials performance from game to game), and an incentive program based on % of calls made correctly would be great ideas. One thing that I really have liked though is the extensive use of the monitor to get 3-pt or not calls right and who gets possession calls right.
by Superelkman on Jan 26, 2010 10:42 AM MST up reply actions
amen - good suggestions
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
What caused the slow down in offense.
Was the fact that the Suns didn’t adjust well to the Jazz getting back on defense. Why did the Jazz get back on defense? Because we had to take the ball out of bounds after made free throws. That was the change in the game. The Suns did not adjust the offense to the Jazz being set. They got used to the fast pace of the first half in which the Jazz did not have a chance to keep up. Happens consistantly with the Suns and every lead they have lost.
TO THE NBA - " Yeah, you have created a rift within me ; Now there have been ; several complications ; that have left me feeling nothing ; I might say, you were ; wrong to take it from me ; Left me feeling nothing " - Disturbed, "Numb"
In my observation,
As soon as the momentum starts to turn towards the opposition, the Suns players get nervous and antsy and start jacking up stupid shots and making mental mistakes leading to turning, trying too hard to immediately counter the other team. This leads to more possessions for the opposition, etc. on and on until lead is gone.
it wasn't close to a foul
perhaps the defender caused his some trouble with the strong wind create by totalling missing Frye’s arm/hand and the ball
Mmmmm ... Guinness
Agreed
Also, when you don’t work for a good shot on offense the defense doesn’t have to work/expend energy either which makes it easier for them to comeback.
by Superelkman on Jan 26, 2010 10:39 AM MST up reply actions
exactly -
also, if you are constantly settling for long jumpers there is a greater potential for long rebounds and fast break or transition buckets for the opposing team, both of which are big momentum builders.
They say "don't swim with the sharks", but I'm faster than sharks so it's not a big deal...
This is the reason I LOVE a team like Utah. They move without the ball SO well and make guys really work on the other end even when they aren’t hitting shots. I think this contributed to the Suns lack of energy in the 2nd half(and the reason they were standing and chucking 3’s). Combine that with Utah hitting their shots and making you work and they are tough to beat. Moving without the ball is so severely underrated. You have to make teams work on both ends of the court.
by Superelkman on Jan 26, 2010 10:49 AM MST up reply actions
Amare
just needs to go. He’s gotten dominated by Anthony Tolliver and glued to the ground Boozer. I’d rather see RoLo and Frye play alongside each other. You’ve got the boards/paint presence and the big guy who can shoot from the arc…
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I wouldn’t want to have that as my starting frontcourt either. Frye is worse than Amare at rebounding and about the same at playing defense. I agree Amare probably needs to be shipped since he is so adamant about a max deal. I don’t blame him though. He knows he will probably get injured again and since so many teams have cap room and will inevitably strike out on signing the really big names all that money will be left for 2nd-tier stars like him.
We just better get something decent for him.
disgusting
Mr Max Contract, 16/5, 4-12 shooting, Boozer 21/20.
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
two or three bad games in a row
actually….starting to think the trade stuff is getting to him
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @sethpo
by Seth Pollack on Jan 26, 2010 9:41 AM MST up reply actions
the expectations for Amare are higher...
Over the course of a season Amare’s numbers will be there. The question is…. can he ever be the main piece on a legit contender. That answer is no because he doesn’t board well and isn’t a good post defender.
20/10 over the last 30 days is nice but his deficiencies are just so glaring on this team for a player that we should expect more from.
by Superelkman on Jan 26, 2010 10:45 AM MST up reply actions
The averages don't mean crap
when you get dominated by your man and disappear in the 4th quarter. But aside from that, 20/10 with no defense and no leadership does not equal a max contract.
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
20/10 with no defense and no leadership
Z-Bo, anyone?
Not really, but it did kind of remind me of him
Mmmmm ... Guinness
Grea recap btw, Wil
The numbers don’t support this, but Nash still looks tired. Especially in the fourth quarter he just seemed listless.
Derron Williams is a tough match-up for a lot of people but he went by Nash like he wasn’t even there. The defense ended up in the zone far more than is “safe” b/c of that. I’ve asked Gentry about using the zone many times. He doesn’t like to do it for more than short stretches. Time and again though we see him going to it far too long. Does he want to do that? No. He has to b/c Nash can’t stay in front of guys like Williams and Rose when his legs aren’t there.
Earlier in the season, Nash was doing much better on the defensive end but now…ugh. Amare’s recent slide is well noted but we can’t ignore Nash either. With Nash though it is physical. His body right now is failing him – at least this week. I am sure he will bounce back but these slides are going to become more frequent as the season grinds on and he continues to age
I mean I hate to say it, but in this
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @sethpo
Nash
Usually makes things look so easy, we forget he’s nearly 36 with some tough miles on him. It’s understandable that he breaks down from time to time. Good time for Frosty to step up. We know he can score, now he needs to learn how to make his teammates successful. If he gets that down, that’s one less piece the Suns need to gather for short and long term.
Blogging Suns Basketball. Twitter: @willcantrellphx
by Wil Cantrell on Jan 26, 2010 10:48 AM MST up reply actions
Stop the turnovers
After starting 14-3, we got a little cocky and then lost the recipe. Then there was a little panic mode, and we started tinkering with the line-up and made things worse. The issue is turnovers and jacking up too many 3’s when we have double digit leads. While you hate to slow it down, when we get a lead,we need to run more pick-and-rolls with Amar’e, keep the ball moving and try to get inside or get fouled. And I agree with Sethpo that Nash is committing more turnovers in the last month or so. And Barbosa is trying to force the issue and turning it over as well. We also need to post up JRich more since he can abuse most guards.
I’m not ready to bail on the season. The upside is that there have been so many close losses, that if we win half of those, everything is “Sunny” and we’re near the top in the West. If we can figure out what’s happening, who’s to say we can’t close with a run similar to how we started the season.
But alas, there’s the trade monster lurking. I would like to hope that after re-signing Nash and Hill, and bringing in Frye, that we can find a way to keep Amar’e here. Otherwise, we add Amar’e to the list of Majerle, Barkley and Marion…former Suns stars who were the face of the franchise, who were shipped off, granted for different reasons. The other thing is that I can’t see Amar’e with the Cavs. While he might work with LeBron, we saw last year that he and Shaq can’t co-exist in the paint. When Amar’e drives, Shaq’s man will be there. And there’s not really a trade out there that’s a real draw…not a realistic trade anyway. Kerr, Sarver and Amar’e need to find a middle ground and keep Amar’e here.
I say blow it up
and build around Dragic, Lopez, and Clark. That’s probably what Kerr wanted to do all along, since these are his guys.
April 29, 2008 Total Eclipse of the Sun. Is the sky falling?
I just wish we had a way to get John Wall
I would trade any combination of players on our roster for that kid.
Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."
The problem there
As much as I love those guys (still not sold on Clark) they aren’t much better than the Timberwolves. You need to find a super star…that is a good way to get into the lottery a couple of times though
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @sethpo
by Seth Pollack on Jan 26, 2010 11:57 AM MST up reply actions
Just think how much Sarver could sell the number one pick for
$3million? $5 million? That would be freaking awesome!!!!!
Can't blow it up
Don’t know about you,but most fans will revolt if you rip the team apart and say we’re rebuilding for the next 3 years. And I’m all for clearing cap room to try and bring in a star…but you can’t attract a Kobe, LeBron, DWade, etc if you gut the team. Hence why teams like the Cavs and Heat would be attractive to someone like Amar’e because as has been stated by others, they use the Bird rule to keep LeBron or Wade, sell them on the fact that we’ve added a key cog to the team. Meanwhile back in Phx, we’re stuck watching D League basketball. We’re going to have to pay SOMEONE in order to get the team in the title hunt. No problem with Dragic, Lopez and Clark as role players, but you’re gonna need a stud or 2 along with them. And what’s missing above is a PG/SG and a SF. If we lose Amar’e we need to get 2 quality starters in return, and I have yet to see a trade option that would bring us anything close to the value that we’re losing. And yeah I know, it’s better than getting nothing if Amar’ opts out, but if we don’t get anything back, not much different.
by FunInTheSun on Jan 26, 2010 11:58 AM MST up reply actions
Most fans are stupid, which is why Kerr needs to ignore most fans.
This team has two choices: rebuild the right way, or stay mired in mediocrity. It’s always darkest before the dawn, as the saying goes. Or “no pain, no gain.”
He’s got a point. Look at the Bulls and the Knicks this decade. Well at least for the Bulls it was a bad choice to gut their entire team. It’s taken them about 11 years just to get a potential star to rebuild around. This decade for us can very much become like the last decade that the Knicks and Bulls had.
I know we’ve always had a decent team or better, but with a new owner and front office things can change. If we trade Amar’e and even J-Rich; how does Nash respond? If we don’t get back good players in return I think Nash ask for a trade in the summer. I’m not sure if he wants to be here in a rebuilding process. I want to keep Nash because we still need him and I don’t like the entire ideal of gutting a team. Young teams need a leader. The Knicks and Bulls sucked for a long time and still do because they’ve yet to find a leader for their team. It’s why we still need Nash. Dragic still has a lot to learn from him and there is evidence that he is learning from Nash. What I’m trying to say is that a poor package for Amar’e won’t cut it. I really think Kerr is going to do all he can to please Nash and get the best deal possible hoping that it convinces Nash to stay.
I'm just happy
None of you are GM of the Suns.
TO THE NBA - " Yeah, you have created a rift within me ; Now there have been ; several complications ; that have left me feeling nothing ; I might say, you were ; wrong to take it from me ; Left me feeling nothing " - Disturbed, "Numb"
Lol, with Sarver running things it wouldn’t make much of a difference if any of us were the GM.
Kerr came in here at the wrong time with no experience and with a bad owner. He’s had to make some tough decisions for an inexperienced GM. I wouldn’t have made the Marion\Shaq trade, but like Kerr I wouldn’t have given him the extension either. The Suns were already on their way down when they got themselves in a financial mess which caused them to give up Kurt Thomas. We were already falling; the Shaq trade just made us fall faster. It was a gamble that would either make or break us. We saw the out-come. I think Kerr has actually done a decent job for the most part.
GM of the Suns
Hey, not saying it’s an easy gig or that the answers are easy…hence the debate and differences of opinion (what’s yours btw?). The fact that some of us are expressing our ideas says that there are no easy answers, and fans, mgmt and teammates will be divided on what’s right. In the end, I think most of us want to see Kerr and Sarver put their best effort into building a team that can contend….in the short term. We’ve been very close for the past 6 years and the window is closing. We don’t want to go through what the Knicks and Bulls have gone through as mentioned above. And we don’t want to become the NBA version of what the Cardinals were before Bidwell FINALLY decided to spend money to keep good players, and went out and brought in other talent to build on.
It also goes back to what Barkley said in his last years here, when the Suns got stuck in between wanting to contend, but wanting to rebuild with the youngsters. Chuck called Suns mgmt out on it, and next thing you know, he’s in Houston. So which are we trying to do: contend or rebuild (aka…save money)?
Bottom line: if you let Amar’e leave, unless we get a quality starter in return, Nash and Hill will likely want out. And if you let them go,then we’re a lottery team for the next couple years until we can draft and/or entice a couple of stars to come here and develop a chemistry. Most of us are saying we’d like to win and contend NOW.
Yeah, you can't just decide you want to contend NOW and get a ticket to the conference finals
i don’t think there are any trades out there that could make this team contend in the near future, and hanging around as we get continually worse just to watch our slim hopes at the playoffs get smaller as OKC, Memphis and scramento pass us by will only make the inevitable rebuild (all teams have to go through it) longer and more agnonising than if we just face up to the fact that our window is closed with these players.
Rebuildin' time..
Then maybe we will be in the lottery with a chance at Wall in 2011. It would just be hard to watch after the run we had from ’04 to ’07.
We won't be in the lottery unless we trade for someone else's first round pick.
We don’t have our own.
As long as we get a first round pick I’ll be ok with any trade. Not satisfied, but ok. Kerr’s draft history hasn’t been too bad. Tucker wasn’t that good of a pick and Strawberry wasn’t bad for a 2nd round pick. Dragic and Lopez have looked good so far. I’d say he’s 3 on picks. That’s good. Clark is still in question. Griffen is… At least he tried to get Blair instead.

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