Jared Dudley Lobbies Phoenix Suns NOT to Trade Amare Stoudemire
by Seth Pollack on Feb 13, 2010 1:13 PM MST
in Phoenix Suns Commentary
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Jared Dudley has done a lot of smart things since coming to the Suns. He's played smart. He's used twitter and other media strategically to help build his personal brand. And as a result he's won the hearts and minds of Suns fans.
Perhaps most importantly for a guy of average NBA talent, Jared's earned the adoration and appreciation of the Phoenix Suns coaching staff.
Now Jared is risking all of that goodwill he's accumulated with his employers by publicly inserting himself into the most important and most complicated decision the team has to make - what to do with Amare Stoudemire.
Jared dropped these tweet bombs which are surely going to get plenty of attention from Robert Sarver and Steve Kerr...
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I think JD is just being a good teammate
If JD makes a “We should have kept Amare” tweet after a trade is made, then that would be career damaging.
I doubt the suns mgmt is gonna get ruffled feathers over this campaign atm.
I still maintain that this is all just vigilant GMship and sincere price negotiation on both sides.
Where are all those Golden State Warriors trolls now?
the telling part is that last tweet - JD is trying to bring the two sides together with fan love.
Where are all those Golden State Warriors trolls now?
Gotta wonder how Kerr is going to react to this..
I am all for STAT staying aslong as its for a resonable contract. If he truely wants to stay here and he wants to compete for a championship, then he should take a lower contract so the team wont be straped for cash!
He’s gotta think about more than just himself, and thats something STAT has always had issues with.
exactly
he wants an owner like Cuban that doesn’t care how much money it costs but there’s only a few of those in the league…everyone else has to deal with reality.
Suns went for it w/ Shaq trade. Had big time salary. As I recall, it was Amare that blew the assignment on Finley in game 1 vs the Spurs and it was Amare that played like crap for the rest of that series
Blogging Suns Basketball . twitter: @sethpo
by Seth Pollack on Feb 13, 2010 2:04 PM MST up reply actions
I think Sun Tzu said it best:
"In this situation, you almost have to take the game of basketball as an escape-goat. When you play the game, it allows you to put everything aside and have fun playing."
-Amar’e Stoudemire
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Ａｍａｒｅ ｗｏｕｌｄ ｔａｋｅ ｌｅｓｓ ｉｆ Ｓｕｎｓ ｍａｎａｇｅｍｅｎｔ ｐｒｏｖｅｓ ｔｈｅｙ ｗａｎｔ ｔｏ ｍａｋｅ ｔｈｅ ｐｌａｙ－ｏｆｆｓ ａｎｄ ｂｕｉｌｄ ａ ｃｏｎｔｅｎｄｅｒ， ｎｏｔ ｊｕｓｔ ｄｕｍｐ ｓａｌａｒｙ．
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by magenta on Feb 14, 2010 12:33 AM MST up reply actions 1 recs
I understand your angle
But the key to this isn’t “is amare useful for the suns”..which of course he is. The key is “is he worth 18-20 million” because the last time I checked, Amare was going after the big payday. He’ll probably get it, and might even deserve it. But not with the Suns.
Why, because not all teams are equal. Some teams – nets (new billionaire owner), mavs – Cuban billionaire owner, lakers , etc can afford it. The Suns cannot.
But, if we make some good choices and work hard, I honestly think we could be a very competitive team. But this current suns team is too weak defensively, and Amare is a big part of that. So is Nash. As much as I like both of those guys, I think Amare needs to go or accept 15-16 million a year.
I'm guessing based on minimal facts we have gotten...but
apparently last week the suns made amare an offer. I doubt it was in the 18-20 million range, but I also doubt it was below 15 million. Until we know what the offer was, hard to say how much of this is Amare going after a huge payday vs the suns not offering enough.
My feeling, that the suns offered 15 million or more for 2-3 years and amare turned it down. Any team would be taking a big risk with amare’s history to do a contract longer than 3 years.
Sorry if my previous post was misleading, I am all for signing Amare to a reasonable extension. But as fans who are you loyal to? Amare as an individual, or the Suns as a team. I think the best move for the team is to try and extend Amare, but if the fans and player on the team start start publicly crying for keeping Amare I feel like that just gives him more leverage to ask for more money. Jared can say that Amare is a great teammate and that he would be upset to see him go under these circumstances but trying to rally fans to the save Amare cause is only going to make keeping him here harder
+1
Great argument, there’s a point where as fans we can say we appreciate what Amare does and I’m sure management knows that.
But there should be a limit there because “Yes” that does give Amare more power in these negotiations, which translates to more dollars.
Almost seems like an Enron deal Amare has with Dudley, Amare giving Dudley a cut if he can land a bigger contract.
Eh .. I wish Dudley would stay out of this
But I don’t think it’s anything too serious. I just hope it doesn’t really sway management’s decision.
Besides, Amare could solve all of this himself and take money he knows the Suns can afford. He keeps saying “oh I don’t know why they’d want to trade me” … um, because you want to commit highway robbery? You said yourself you know they aren’t willing to give out max money, yet you keep demanding it. Sounds to me like you want to leave.
You can't criticise a guy for wanting as much money as he can get
He knows that someone will pay him what he wants in free agency, and he thinks he’s worth it (whether or not he actually is is irrelevant) and therefore feels disrespected that the suns won’t offer it. Sure you can say that he should take a pay cut to make the team better but if you were in the same situation would you accept 10-20% less than what someone will pay you just so you don’t have to move workplace, what NBA players actually would accept less than what they are (a team thinks) they are worth? Not many. I’m not saying we should pay amar’e the max i think we should trade him for something now but i can completely understand the situation he’s in.
Oh I get it
But what I’m saying is, there’s no way he should be “I don’t understand why they’re looking to trade me”.
Respect to Jared Dudley..But I agree this has gone on to long the front office has to make a decision its not fair to amare or us for them to put him on the trade block every year this flip flopping on what to do is the reason I dont trust the Front Office with cap space if times is rough then Sarver should sell the team..and honestly the better team you put on the floor the more money you will make so making the playoffs are a priority as far as Sarver is concerned
by Lebrontophx2010 on Feb 13, 2010 3:13 PM MST reply actions
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but Stoudemire is believed to be using the three-year, $57 million extension Los Angeles Lakers forward Pau Gasol(notes) received this season as a framework for talks.
yes we all know that is what he wants
THe issue isn’t the number of years as much as it is the $$$$. You keep bringing this up and referring to gasol’s contract…..do you think amare should get 57 million for 3 years?? i love amare, but not that much….suns won’t pay him that much either or else we wouldn’t be beating this dead horse into the ground.
No we didn't know that is what he is asking for
To be honest if the extension is 3 years at 19 Million a year that is a favorable deal for the Suns, we all know Amare when healthy is worth 19 a year the issue was giving Amare a 5-6 year deal because we dont know how he will hold up.
19 MILLION 3 Years you HAVE to do it.
by SSOHOWARD on Feb 13, 2010 5:21 PM MST up reply actions 1 recs
It has been written all over this site
that he is using gasol’s contract in his contract negotiations and no i don’t think amare is worth that and management doesn’t either or this puppy would be done already
Its not been all over this site, bro the issue was with the years if he is using Gasols contract for dollar wise 19 a year it only makes sense if it for 3 years the issue is that if we stretch it forr 5-6 we have to drop it a bit per year.
I thought the issue was with both dollars AND number of years
it is all over the site and 19 million for stat is horrible, not worth it, 15-17 topssss
no you don't, way to tie all that up to a guy who can't create his own shot, isn't clutch, and is defensively challenged for how athletic he is
with that said i do love stat BUT he isn’t the superstar he thinks he is….he’s a great player
The issue is not the dollars and cents
the issue is his health and we cannot lock him up long term like he wants
He wants 5 years THAT is the issue.
I don't really want to argue with you what Amare is worth
Point is Sarver gave him a deal where he’d be making 18 at the end so that alone puts it into perspective what Sarver thinks he is worth.
12-14 range for a producing big man in teh NBA is ridiculously low, sure I’d love for him to take 12-14 but we all know he’s worth more than that
No I'm pretty sure Amare signed his max right before his MF
Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2180248
wrong bra!!! you know you need to come with some accurate backing to what you say and not make stuff up
sorry
that was meant for sssohoward, amare signed his deal BEFORE knee surgery
dude if money weren’t an issue and i was running the team sure i’d give it to him, but the suns aren’t gonnna do it thats all i’m saying
What is your basis? Who are your contacts in the office? you are pulling numbers out of the air and not giving reasoning for them.
who are yours?? you seem to know everything about evaluating talent and money and what amare is worth, tell me how its gonna go down. you really think amare will get 19 mill?
I think if its not in PHX Amare will get 19 million + per year. A big man who’s averaging 22 a game whos in the prime of his career can get that money in the open market. The price of a good big man is very expensive.
exactly!!
IF IT"S NOT IN PHX…..he will get paid better somewhere else and he won’t get that here.
You are way off base about Sarver, he is willing to spend but he needs a return on investment. Sarver was willing to take on Shaq’s bloated deal to try to compete in teh playoffs so why do you think he won’t spend if he is getting wins out of it? Sarver also outbid Mark Cuban for Steve Nash.
To say Sarver won’t spend is crazy, he just doens’t want to pay a dude 20 million to sit on the bench injured when the dude is in his early thirties.
and why was that? because shaq wasn’t a good fit here. but if shaq was a good fit here do you think he would have unloaded his contract?? I’m thinking it would be crazy to trade marion for shaq for a season just to trade shaq for nothing. the deal didnt work out but at least he tried.
If you are going to argue about what Amare’s worth you have to come in with some backing to what you say. You can’t just put a price on him because of “feel” thats not fair.
hey ssohoward
i feel you…but there’s more variables involved than simply “what is amare worth?”
Is he worth 18-20 million a year…yes. Even with the injuries. But is he worth that to the suns. I don’t think so. And neither does kerr or sarver or the suns offer last week to amare wouldve gone back and forth and then agreed upon. Clearly (just guessing) that the Suns offer was 3-5 million less a year than what Amare will likely get from 2-3 teams out there.
If we were leading the division and weren’t so hot and cold and so poor on defense as a team. I think I’d have a different number for Amare’s value, but because of the Suns likely being a 1 round playoff team this year and next (without changes), I’m going with $15 million a year for amare. But I’ll be happy if/when he gets 18-20 million a year somewhere else. The Suns need to rebuild.
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+1
No way he is woth nearly 20 million per… just absolutely no way… not with this CBA and especially not with the new CBA
howard
so what would you do if you were kerr? BUT the caviat is that you can only give him 17 per sarver
Why would Sarver give him a 18 million dollar player option next year if he was only offering 17 million maximum? It wouldnt happen like that.
If the deal was for 3 years you bet your ass Kerr would hop on that, but I think Kerr and Amare both know that if given a 5-6 year deal Amare’s knees wont hold up that long. I mean come on by the end of that deal Amare will be 33.
then why is yahoo and espn reporting that they are using the gasol deal in negotiating???
its only 3 years!
Using the Gasol deal as a guide I can rest assure you that deals are more complicated than just a dollar figure an amount of years and a couple signatures…
Did Kerr or anyone say that the Gasol deal is the basis for Amare's deal?
No it is pure speculation by writers and critics, that has never publicly been announced.
Also, just because Sarver thought Amar'e was worth $18m a couple years ago
doesn’t mean he still thinks that. We all thought Amar’e was poised to take the next step, and now that he hasn’t, I really don’t think we should offer him anything close to what Gasol got.
Yeah, but he'll likely pull the
“They don’t respect me, why should I try for a team that doesn’t respect me?” card. Just so he has an excuse to not try to take the next step.
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by Trevor Paxton on Feb 13, 2010 11:23 PM MST up reply actions
if we do nothing now....
and Amare goes somewhere else this summer. Doesn’t the Suns have Amare’s current salary to sign someone else? I don’t know whom. But I still don’t fully the concept that “if Amare walks, we get nothing in return”.
You can only sign players with the amount you are under the cap
because we over over the cap line at the moment, when Amar’es salary comes the books we’ll only have 7-8million to sign someone, which isn’t enough to get an amar’e replacement.
I know im not the only gambler on this site
Why not take a chance and leave this team together and see what they can so??
Just keep Amare and lets see how they do in playoffs. When everyone is into the game (meaning they remember defense is played in a basketball game too) they can beat anyone in the league.
The playoffs could be VERY interesting….
And without amare we would NEVER know what could have happened. Every trade possibility makes this team worse this season and i think EVERYONE can agree with that
Let the nash era end right, and not end with him rebuilding new players he will never play with. The man just ran the Olympic torch in Canada, then won the skills competition in dallas AT 36!! PLUS he is playing just like he was during the MVP years.
SO.. lets give Nash a shot at a ring!!!
SO.. lets give Nash a shot at a ring!!!And if they dont do well in the playoffs?? We got to watch our Phoenix Suns and your boy Steve Nash do everything they could to get a ring with what they had, while giving our young players some playoff experience
SO.. lets give Nash a shot at a ring!!!And if they dont do well in the playoffs?? We got to watch our Phoenix Suns and your boy Steve Nash do everything they could to get a ring with what they had, while giving our young players some playoff experienceWe are fans people, not management. We watch the game. We want our team to go as far as they can and win the championship. Have you all forgotten this??
SO.. lets give Nash a shot at a ring!!!And if they dont do well in the playoffs?? We got to watch our Phoenix Suns and your boy Steve Nash do everything they could to get a ring with what they had, while giving our young players some playoff experienceWe are fans people, not management. We watch the game. We want our team to go as far as they can and win the championship. Have you all forgotten this??If amare walks next season guess what? I will still be watching the Suns
Bravo! Bravo PHXmane!
I couldn’t have said it better myself. You echoed alot of what I have been thinking about this.
Just keep Amare and let’s see how they do in the playoffs.When everyone is into the game (meaning they remember defense is played in a basketball game too) they can beat anyone in the league.
We are fans. You said it. It is true. We are not management. Why should we care if Amare gets an extra 2-3 million per yr over 3 years? It is not likely to break the bank for Sarver. The playoff revenue the Suns bring in should soften the psychological blow for Sarver.
Every trade possibility makes this team worse this season (.)
Again true. Nash is playing great this season, but we don’t know how much longer he can do that.
I agree that the Suns need to go for it all; go for the brass ring. If Cuban were the owner do you think he’d be entertaining the idea of trading a stud PF for expiring contracts or fringe players?
We are fans. Amare is not a bad guy. He hasn’t pulled guns on his teammates or been arrested for DUI’s or vehicular manslaughter. He is a good teammate and a solid citizen in addition to being a dynamic force. Keep him and let this team play!
The Suns have backed themselves into a tight corner by sitting on this until now. At this point their options are very limited. Basically I will be disappointed if one of two scenarios plays out.
Scenario 1: They trade Amare without offering him an extension.
At this point it should be clear to the front office just how important the team and fans feel Amare is. If they simply trade him without offering him a reasonable extension that suit what they feel he is worth I will be upset, and none of that JJ low ballin bs.
Scenario 2: They offer Amare the extension, he refuses, but we decide to finish the season with him.
If they offer the extension and he doesn’t take it then his true colors are shown and he must be traded. At that point the Suns could easily tell the team/fans that they tried to reach an agreement but Amare wouldn’t accept and they had to make a move while they could.
on jj
obviously joe is great. If he didn’t get hurt and had stayed with the suns, plus marion. This suns dream team could’ve gone on for a few years…But I think it’s important to realize that team was stacked.
Nash
Amare
Marion
Joe Johnson
My point, there is only so much money to go around. Losing Joe and not offering him enough ahead of time sucked, but what can you do…just add it to the list of suns heartbreak
How would you have paid that team??
Each one of those guys would demand 15+ and Amare and JJ wanted more. Thats a lot of payroll locked up in 4 guys.
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He was willing but he has to be capable of spending that, with a salary cap how would you go about spending that money and then adding 8 more guys on that roster? It COULDN"T be done man not with the current CBA.
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thursday
come thursday he is either here for the season or we have traded him and moved on or he finally signs an ext. the mavs made a 7 player trade with wizards.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4913305
If this is true and we just get Ilgauskus and Hickson I am going to be fucking pissed off. They better send 2 1sts as well if they are only sending us that shit for Stat. Seriously, if that trade happens I will really have a hard time being a fan of this team with it’s stupid fucking ownership.
I really like Hickson as young player but just him and cap relief for stat is a felony.
Come to your senses Kerr and Sarver
for sure...
but the offer on the table, according to that article, is hickson and ilgauskus…
they better send something else back…
seriously…. reading that got me rally pissed…
i’d much rather just get beasley if we just gonna dump for a player and cap relief
beasley is a headcase but has much greater upside than hickson…
hickson is and will be solid but does not have the star potential beasley has
by Superelkman on Feb 14, 2010 11:22 AM MST up reply actions
Totally
Thats why the argument was made in the other thread that nothing has come out of Phx yet, don’t you think Phx writers would have hit on this first not some Jamoke in the back office of an ESPN office??
If its any consolidation Barkley is in love with JJ Hickson…
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by magenta on Feb 14, 2010 7:33 PM MST up reply actions 1 recs
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