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Why our problems boil down to the coach

I like Alvin Gentry. He's a great coach on a winning team. But when it comes to a team that needs motivation, he's shown he doesn't have the chutzpah to really tell his players off. Every time we "listen in" on a bench meeting, he sounds like a sad disappointed father telling his son "Well, you shouldn't eat candy okay? Oh you're going to eat the candy? Well, I suppose that's okay too. But I'm just going to tell you, that candy is no good for you." I don't think that'd light a fire in anyone to play hard. There might be an argument that the team simply isn't talented. Yes, we're a terrible team talent-wise. We have players in roles they never should be put in. Frye is a starter when he's obviously a bench player. Dudley is a starter when he's obviously a sixth man. Brown is a basketball player when he obviously should be selling hot dogs. It's a big shitstorm. But that doesn't excuse Gentry from not being able to get the best out of his players. It doesn't just apply to this season either. Looking at last season, the two players that we "lost" in FA this previous offseason are Vince Carter and Mickael Pietrus. Now they're with the Mavericks and Celtics, respectively. Looking at Carter's stats, it doesn't indicate he's doing any better than when he played for the Suns. But you can't overlook the fact that he looks to be playing better when you watch the Mavs play. Yes, he's no longer the "#1 go-to" option but I'm pretty sure we all knew he wasn't that option the moment he started playing last season. So the question is, why in the world would Gentry continue to force him into a role he doesn't belong in? It's great that he believes in his players, but putting them in a position to fail is not a great way to get the best out of your players. Pietrus, on the other hand, was obviously disgruntled with the Suns. With the Celtics, he's getting more minutes with fewer points but a better defined role. Shooting a better percentage overall and from 3 as well. When we watched Pietrus last season, it looked like he was lost on offense, throwing the ball up at every opportunity. But with the Celtics, his role seems to be defined better.

So why couldn't we get that out of our players? It may be the players. That we don't have the veterans. Wait, we have Hill and Nash. That can't be it. Maybe we don't have the star power. Yea that makes sense, but the Celtics are aging and really their best player is Rondo. It's up to the coaches to get the players to play right and play smart and it always seems like Gentry can't do that. The one successful season in 09-10 was more about the players than Gentry.

It's time to get some turnover. We know Nash can run the system on his own so Gentry isn't really needed. So why is he still around?

tldr: Gentry doesn't put players in a position to succeed.

Comment 23 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Gentry sucks at rotations

I would start Brown over Dudz, because as much we all love him he is not a SG, he is a bench SF, besides his defense hasn’t been there in a while, Brown can thrive very well next to Nash, he can D, he can score and here is the tricky part, Is he a hot head? Yes, What have Gentry done to get the max out of him ? Bench him.

Morris is great but I think he is getting too comfortable launching jumpers sometimes, I would love to see him more under the rim, I don’t know Gentry’s posture about this but he seems OK

I realize he has no decents Back up PG or SF ot C, but ir RoLo turns out fine in another team then I’ll be sure Gentry sucks at coaching young players.

roses are red violets are blue, Michael Redd is coming for you!

by Lino Canaan on Feb 19, 2012 2:13 PM MST via mobile reply actions  

How many more wins would Phil Jackson or Greg Popovich get out of this motley crew..?

Gotta look at reality…How much more impressive is 29-37 versus 24-42…? Seriously.

Bootycracklicious anyway you look at it…

Let's do this...!

by Daryl Ray on Feb 19, 2012 5:42 PM MST reply actions  

That's how I feel

I don’t think Gentry is doing a great job, and wouldn’t mind seeing someone else running the team, but they just don’t have the talent to be great regardless who the coach is, and if you’re paying Gentry regardless, and the team isn’t contending regardless, then what’s the point of paying someone else on top of that, for fairly negligible improvements.

Tom Leander doesn't understand what "rock bottom" means.

by wedge1039 on Feb 19, 2012 9:11 PM MST up reply actions   2 recs

This is not meant to be an end-all solution.

Yea we don’t have the talent to get where we want to be. But Gentry isn’t really doing a great job either. I’m just suggesting some turnover as a whole.

by lixuec on Feb 20, 2012 1:23 AM MST up reply actions  

Definitely agree with you

I’m just not sure changing coaches right now would be a very good decision financially, when you would have to pay two coaches, and it won’t change the end results that much. I highly support having a new head coach in place before next training camp.

Tom Leander doesn't understand what "rock bottom" means.

by wedge1039 on Feb 20, 2012 8:57 AM MST up reply actions  

Especially

When we still have Steve Nash. If he is returning for the rest of his career, I don’t think it makes much sense to get a new head coach either.

"If Gortat pulls off a real Dream Shake in-game this year I will shave my head.
Mark my words." Piotr Szczesniak 12/12/11 2:12 PM
Cardinals, Suns, D-backs for life!

by Airwave on Feb 20, 2012 1:57 PM MST up reply actions  

Replacing the coach isn't supposed to be the quick fix or an immediate move.

I just can’t see Gentry taking a team into the Finals when the pressure really gets put on and you need a steadying hand.

by lixuec on Feb 20, 2012 2:54 PM MST up reply actions  

Babby's comment on Gentry

Babby didn’t really defend Gentry when asked, only he said ‘he still has another year on his contract’, as if to say ‘I know he isn’t that good, but we are going to stick with it’. Not much confedence in Gentry.

by rdgroce on Feb 20, 2012 7:07 PM MST up reply actions  

First, may I suggest breaking it up into paragraphs? People don’t like walls of text.

Second, all the things you mentioned (defined role, etc.) is exactly what made that ‘09-10 team special. You can’t take that away from Gentry, because with a good roster he was able to do what you want your coach to do. It’s always more about the players than the coach. The NBA is a player’s league. But the coach deserves the credit for putting his players in the right position to succeed, which you said Gentry doesn’t but he clearly did in ’09-10.

Third, wedge made an excellent post above.

Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!

Read my thoughts on Creighton University athletics at Creightonian.com

I also edit things at Ridiculous Upside. Check it out.

by Omaha Sun on Feb 19, 2012 11:58 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

Too long, didn't read

"If Gortat pulls off a real Dream Shake in-game this year I will shave my head.
Mark my words." Piotr Szczesniak 12/12/11 2:12 PM
Cardinals, Suns, D-backs for life!

by Airwave on Feb 20, 2012 1:57 PM MST up reply actions  

ahh. I didn’t understand that either. The Reader’s Digest version, I suppose.

by BringBackBarkley17 on Feb 22, 2012 1:40 PM MST up reply actions  

It's all good

The internet has so many phrases haha not everyone knows them

"If Gortat pulls off a real Dream Shake in-game this year I will shave my head.
Mark my words." Piotr Szczesniak 12/12/11 2:12 PM
Cardinals, Suns, D-backs for life!

by Airwave on Feb 22, 2012 4:28 PM MST up reply actions  

I wouldn't go so far as to say Gentry is "the problem"

That honor goes to the GM for putting together a roster that lacks a starting-caliber PF, or anything resembling an isolation scorer. He can share that honor with Babby, since the ‘plan’ doesn’t seem to call for winning this year.

On the other hand, I don’t feel Gentry is a great coach. It’s one thing to run a system offense, but it’s another to have virtually no other options outside that system.

Voted most likely to say "I told you so"

by jc79 on Feb 20, 2012 1:02 PM MST reply actions  

As a coach myself, i try not to be too harsh

simply because i know that people on the outside looking in really are in no position to judge the job you are doing, regardless of your basketball knowledge. Sure, you may have an opinion, but your are basing that opinion on circumstantial information.

Unless you are in their practice, in the locker room during games and in the huddles during timeouts [not just one, but all], you really have no perspective on what is being stressed and whether those things are being absorbed by the players or not.

I have had teams that were simply bereft of offensive players. Despite the fact that I worked them to the bone running our motion and putting in simple quick hit plays [maybe one or two – all they could handle], the players were simply not skilled, nor intelligent enough to handle pressure against better teams. The talent was simply not there.

Despite all of the hard work I and my players put in, we still had parents coming down into my timeout huddles and “making suggestions”. From the stands, they wanted to take the evidence of a team that could not score [or turned it over] and jump to the conclusion that I was not teaching them anything.

However, when I invited said parent to my practice, it took one practice for him to see that I indeed was teaching and that these players were simply lacking basketball IQ, athleticism and skill. That is how it goes sometimes. Once this parent realized what had been talked about over and over again in practice, yet failed to materialize in games, he realized that he should change his expectations and focus on cheering for his child when he does something positive.

As pertains to Gentry, while I can see things on the court that I would say or limitations, I am not in his practice, huddles or locker room. It isn’t my place to assume I know what goes on and what is said. Therefore, judging him based only on what I see on the court is unfair.

Additionally, if you were to fire gentry, who would replace him? I don’t see anyone out there that would do any better of a job.

by hubertdavisfor3 on Feb 21, 2012 5:19 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

Talent beats hustle

When hustle has no talent

"Clear eyes, full hearts, can't lose"

by phxpurple on Feb 22, 2012 4:30 PM MST via Android app reply actions  

Not always the case...

Many times a talented team with no hustle (or teamwork) gets beat by non-talented teams with far more hustle (and teamwork)

Let's do this...!

by Daryl Ray on Feb 23, 2012 7:01 AM MST up reply actions  

I dub this

the “Jared Dudley principle”

Voted most likely to say "I told you so"

by jc79 on Feb 23, 2012 3:23 PM MST up reply actions  

Haha

Dont eat the candy mmmkay.

"Clear eyes, full hearts, can't lose"

by phxpurple on Feb 23, 2012 7:07 PM MST via Android app reply actions  

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