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Around SBN: The Most Dangerous Division in Sports

Suns Turn up the Defense in the 4th, Beat Shorthanded Bobcats, 95-89

It shouldn't be so difficult to defeat the league's worst team at home, especially when said team is missing their top three scorers. But there were our Suns trailing the Bobcats 54-44 in the 3rd quarter tonight before the bench came in to save the day, and the Suns escaped total embarrassment by pulling out a 95-89 win.

Michael Redd got the start in place of the injured (thigh bruise) Jared Dudley. Dudley looked quite dapper in his suit on the bench and Redd looked impressive himself, leading the Suns with 17 points behind 4-7 3-point shooting.

The Suns also received excellent production from their two centers as Marcin Gortat put up yet another double-double with 12 points and 12 rebounds, and Robin Lopez was the player of the game during the decisive 4th quarter. Lopez ended up with 13 points and 6 rebounds in 20 minutes of play, in what was his best performance since the season opener almost a month and a half ago.

My mom always taught me never to look a gift horse in the mouth, and a win is a win. But, to beat this team when they're shorthanded, well....a win is a win.

Star-divide

The Suns had five players in double digit scoring, but the bench was the real story. The game was tied at 72 going into the 4th, and then the Bobcats showed why they are the league's worst team, scoring 3 points in the first 8 minutes of the quarter as the Suns seized an 84-75 lead when Alvin Gentry sent Steve Nash back into the game to seal the deal. Nash immediately hit a jumper to push the lead to 11 and the Suns coasted to victory from then.

Kemba Walker had a nice game as he led all scorers with 22 points but he went cold along with the rest of the Bobcats and scored only 3 in the 4th, and only had 4 assists in 41 minutes. Reggie Williams scored 21, but the Bobcats bench was overmatched as their bench players were forced into starting duty due to injuries to starters. The Suns' bench outscored the Bobcats' 40-15.

To be fair, the Suns bench didn't benefit solely from Charlotte's ineffectiveness and did play strong defense, yet the story is mostly told by a poor opponent playing poorly. A win is a win, and a win here is so much better than a loss to this terrible team. I was contemplating the headline and tone of this story had the Suns lost and it was leaning in an apocalyptic direction. Whew, apocalypse isn't now....quite.


Final - 2.4.2012 1 2 3 4 Total
Charlotte Bobcats 24 24 24 17 89
Phoenix Suns 25 17 30 23 95

Complete Coverage >


Postgame Quotes:

"The major problem was when Lopez came in. We didn't box him out and it really changed the whole game around." -- Paul Silas

"I was happy with the way the reserves played which is why they stayed in the game. Robin came in and did a great job and really gave us a big lift and got us over the hump." -- Alvin Gentry

"The was definitely really good for us. Closing out the game like that, I think the game was tied when the bench came in and we ended up pulling it out. I think we can keep playing with that energy -- I mean obviously we will play some better teams -- hopefully, our energy, we can translate that into some wins." -- Robin Lopez

"You know what, one of the proudest moments in my career. One of the proudest moments in my career, and to get the win was obviously the key. But to come back through the tears, through the hurt, through the hours of rehab, training, to come back and accomplish this is maybe the most proudest moment of my career actually." -- Michael Redd



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"SIR ALEX FERGUSON" Greatest Manager of all time

by phxuk: Ap on Feb 4, 2012 9:58 PM MST reply actions  

GET THAT out of my house

Crashing the [message] boards from the swamps of Louisiana, and blogging Phoenix Suns!

by PHXgp on Feb 4, 2012 10:08 PM MST up reply actions  

I don't care, that was a really entertaining game

Dunk, dunk dunk, dunk!
Three, three, three, three!
Nash makes first NBA block!
Robin Lopez shows up for a game awake!

Good times.

I'm Michael Beasley's imaginary friend.

by suns68 on Feb 4, 2012 10:01 PM MST via mobile reply actions   2 recs

You must not know.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioI1EhSc9fQ

They call him The Flyswatter.

"I'm a nobody." - Steve Nash in 1997

by PHXSunsRunNGun on Feb 4, 2012 10:24 PM MST up reply actions  

ha! awesome.

And, by the way, it wasn’t an entire game that was entertaining. what you described was the 3rd quarter. Although the 4th was ok too.

Grant Hill for prez.

by sun-arc on Feb 4, 2012 11:14 PM MST via mobile up reply actions  

Nash has 89 career blocks. One every 12.49 games.

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
"In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip."

by haremoor on Feb 5, 2012 8:51 AM MST up reply actions  

We win!

Nothing else matters!
Suns win!
Suns win!
Suns win!

SUNS WIN!!!!!!!!

Just because Steve Nash has that "dirty hipster" look doesn't mean he's in need of a shower. Steve Nash bathes in the tears of his victims on a nightly basis.

Mark of a Beast, baby. Mark of a Beast.

by NashMV3 on Feb 4, 2012 10:02 PM MST reply actions  

they're an NBA team just like we are.

Crashing the [message] boards from the swamps of Louisiana, and blogging Phoenix Suns!

by PHXgp on Feb 4, 2012 10:09 PM MST up reply actions  

Exactly!

I didn’t intend for that comment to come off as negative.

Don't trade Dudley!

by Beavis 25 on Feb 4, 2012 10:17 PM MST up reply actions  

Steak dinners for everyone!

Arizona Cardinals/Chicago Bears fan
Phoenix Suns, Arizona Diamondbacks, Phoenix Coyotes, Arizona Rattlers fan
[I have always lived in Arizona, dad is from Chicago].

Leading the NFL in swagtangibles

by JoeCB1991 on Feb 4, 2012 10:26 PM MST up reply actions  

Suns win and the Mavs & Lakers lose.

Great great great Saturday.

Just because Steve Nash has that "dirty hipster" look doesn't mean he's in need of a shower. Steve Nash bathes in the tears of his victims on a nightly basis.

Mark of a Beast, baby. Mark of a Beast.

by NashMV3 on Feb 4, 2012 10:07 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

Mine was terrible.

I woke up and had to shovel 8 inches of snow out of my driveway. Due to that snow, all the basketball games were canceled which meant I missed out on $90 I otherwise would have made. Then Creighton lost on a buzzer-beating 3. Then I found out I drove over a nail and my tire was flat, so I had to put on my donut. If the Suns had lost, I might have just given up and not even bothered getting out of bed tomorrow.

Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!

Read my thoughts on Creighton University athletics at Creightonian.com

I also edit things at Ridiculous Upside. Check it out.

by Omaha Sun on Feb 4, 2012 11:21 PM MST up reply actions  

HHAHAHAHAHAHAHA but also very sad

by SunsASJD134 on Feb 4, 2012 11:23 PM MST up reply actions  

Wow....

I am so sorry. At least Robin managed to save your night! Now he can go back to the Batcave happy.

Just because Steve Nash has that "dirty hipster" look doesn't mean he's in need of a shower. Steve Nash bathes in the tears of his victims on a nightly basis.

Mark of a Beast, baby. Mark of a Beast.

by NashMV3 on Feb 4, 2012 11:26 PM MST up reply actions  

:(

NBA Blog: www.nbagirl.tumblr.com
Non-NBA Blog: www.reallycoolshenans.tumblr.com
Follow me on Twitter: @PhxSunsGirl84

"Great things come to those who work."

by Dragic_is_Magic on Feb 4, 2012 11:32 PM MST up reply actions  

woo hoo we are winning just enough to get a lousy draft pick and not near enough to make play offs….genius

by good like a-1 beer on Feb 4, 2012 10:09 PM MST reply actions  

tuned in in time

to see Robin Lopez looking really good.

what y’all think? Improving his trade value a bit? Hope he keeps bringing it.

Crashing the [message] boards from the swamps of Louisiana, and blogging Phoenix Suns!

by PHXgp on Feb 4, 2012 10:10 PM MST reply actions  

Now, THAT would be a story.

12 rebounds. Thanks, I corrected it.

Blogging Suns basketball for Bright Side of the Sun from California wine country.
Twitter: @EastBayRaymundo

by East Bay Ray on Feb 4, 2012 10:13 PM MST up reply actions  

haha it's all good

excellent writeup besides that, ray!

66-0 let's goooo

by 2time on Feb 4, 2012 10:44 PM MST up reply actions  

Glad to get the win...

We needed it for sure. I was hoping to beat the worst team in the league who were missing some of their best players a little more convincingly…but yeah, at least we won.

Blogging Suns basketball for Bright Side of the Sun from Gilbert, AZ.
Follow me on Twitter: @thereal7footer

by 7footer on Feb 4, 2012 10:11 PM MST via mobile reply actions  

Going to watch some of this game since I missed it...

Query…anyone know what those dashes under the score are? I get bonus…but the dashes?

Never lowercase the SUNS in Phoenix SUNS!

by sidepart on Feb 4, 2012 10:40 PM MST reply actions  

Timeouts?

I think that’s what you are referring to.

Blogging Suns basketball for Bright Side of the Sun from Gilbert, AZ.
Follow me on Twitter: @thereal7footer

by 7footer on Feb 4, 2012 10:47 PM MST via mobile up reply actions  

Thought so…wasn’t sure.

Never lowercase the SUNS in Phoenix SUNS!

by sidepart on Feb 4, 2012 11:14 PM MST up reply actions  

NEVERMIND

League Pass Broadband has managed to archive EVER SINGLE game in about 1.5 hrs since a game completed…but nope…not when it’s a SUNS game. Been nearly 2.5 hours and it’s still archiving.

Never lowercase the SUNS in Phoenix SUNS!

by sidepart on Feb 4, 2012 11:15 PM MST up reply actions  

A win is a win. So nice to see Robin show up finally and Redd hit some shots. Give Dudley some pressure. Maybe this will give us some momentum.

by BringBackBarkley17 on Feb 4, 2012 10:41 PM MST reply actions  

can someone tell me why we are happy the suns are winning??? WE NEED A TOP 5 PICK! wether that means trading nash and sucking or just losing at home, idc we need a top 5 pick this year so unless we face the lakers or spurs or celtics, im hoping for a L

by SunsASJD134 on Feb 4, 2012 10:51 PM MST reply actions  

That's it right there.

Losing is for losers. We’re not losers.

Blogging Suns basketball for Bright Side of the Sun from California wine country.
Twitter: @EastBayRaymundo

by East Bay Ray on Feb 4, 2012 10:54 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

yes i know losing sucks, but would you rather tank the season and have a top 3 pick and miss playoffs or would you rather stay mediocre and miss the playoffs and have a #12 or 13 pick???

by SunsASJD134 on Feb 4, 2012 11:15 PM MST up reply actions  

This.

A thousand times this.

sententia Platonis semper in ore illius fuit, florere civitates si aut philosophi imperarent aut imperantes philosopharentur

by NASCARbernet on Feb 5, 2012 8:08 PM MST up reply actions  

We kind of are tanking

I mean look who they signed to try and get us in the playoffs.

Don't trade Dudley!

by Beavis 25 on Feb 6, 2012 11:33 AM MST up reply actions  

Also, the only way we get top 5 is if the lottery ball bounces our way

Charlotte, New Orleans, and some more eastern teams have locked down the tanking process. We can’t outsuck them

@jatrex
is the Phoenix about to rise after burning or the ashes has been blown away

by jatrex4suns on Feb 5, 2012 4:27 AM MST via mobile up reply actions  

Touching Michael Redd story

http://arizona.sbnation.com/phoenix-suns/2012/2/4/2772346/michael-redd-phoenix-suns-2012

warmed my heart….and my heart is cold as a witches broom in a January snow storm in Maine (which is not how my Grandfather used to say that but this is a family show…)

Twitter me at: @sethpo

by Seth Pollack on Feb 4, 2012 10:51 PM MST reply actions   3 recs

That makes me tear up.

NBA Blog: www.nbagirl.tumblr.com
Non-NBA Blog: www.reallycoolshenans.tumblr.com
Follow me on Twitter: @PhxSunsGirl84

"Great things come to those who work."

by Dragic_is_Magic on Feb 4, 2012 10:57 PM MST up reply actions  

It warmed the cockles of my heart.

Just because Steve Nash has that "dirty hipster" look doesn't mean he's in need of a shower. Steve Nash bathes in the tears of his victims on a nightly basis.

Mark of a Beast, baby. Mark of a Beast.

by NashMV3 on Feb 4, 2012 11:04 PM MST up reply actions  

cockles?

cock-les?
cockless?
you insulting me Sir??!

"Clear eyes, full hearts, can't lose"

by phxpurple on Feb 4, 2012 11:51 PM MST up reply actions  

Yes.

Because of all the people for me to make fun of, it’s gotta be you.

Just because Steve Nash has that "dirty hipster" look doesn't mean he's in need of a shower. Steve Nash bathes in the tears of his victims on a nightly basis.

Mark of a Beast, baby. Mark of a Beast.

by NashMV3 on Feb 5, 2012 12:02 AM MST up reply actions  

Must start Redd

forever.

"I don't lift weights because they are heavy, and I don't run because it makes me tired." - Charles Barkley

by Suns R Us on Feb 5, 2012 12:55 AM MST up reply actions  

Im all for redd starting

However when jd is healthy it will have to come at the expense of jchills minutes and even some shannon brown mins,I would also like to see price get the backup point mins,I dont dislike telfair but he dribbles to much wout gettin the team into there offense.

skitsophrenics are never alone-Just ask scott howard

by stevedavis_ on Feb 5, 2012 1:29 PM MST up reply actions  

if chilly is producing

i say take brown out. he seems disruptive to the offense and there were time that he could have used the double teams he was getting to dish off for a nice assist. JYD will at least make the extra pass. J.chill has been great on D and his points are coming. I like to see him play more with nash and some of the other starters. maybe be the first guy of the bench to come in for hill

"Clear eyes, full hearts, can't lose"

by phxpurple on Feb 5, 2012 2:54 PM MST up reply actions  

What Gentry does at the back-up point should be interesting.

Both guys have some major flaws, but both have shown at least something. I think Bassy has been a bit better as of late, and Price has been playing a lot of 2 because he’s just not capable of running an offense.

Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!

Read my thoughts on Creighton University athletics at Creightonian.com

I also edit things at Ridiculous Upside. Check it out.

by Omaha Sun on Feb 5, 2012 3:14 PM MST up reply actions  

Actually I think he is more capable than Bassy

but he can’t shoot jack shit from 15+ feet.
thus the 1-5 PnR doesn’t work at all when he is on the floor.

he ran Jazz offense pretty well last year.

Feed the cutter!!!

by Piotr Szczesniak on Feb 6, 2012 6:10 AM MST up reply actions  

I don't know about that.

He looked incompetent as PG in the games I saw. That’s why i wasn’t a fan of the signing. No offensive game. He’s just an athlete who hustles.

Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!

Read my thoughts on Creighton University athletics at Creightonian.com

I also edit things at Ridiculous Upside. Check it out.

by Omaha Sun on Feb 6, 2012 11:35 AM MST up reply actions  

Great recap.

That was somehow one of the most entertaining games of the whole year.
Any win feels good, and this is no exception.

I’m particularly happy for Michael Redd.

NBA Blog: www.nbagirl.tumblr.com
Non-NBA Blog: www.reallycoolshenans.tumblr.com
Follow me on Twitter: @PhxSunsGirl84

"Great things come to those who work."

by Dragic_is_Magic on Feb 4, 2012 11:09 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

hey , check out my new fanpost, tell me what you think???

by SunsASJD134 on Feb 4, 2012 11:16 PM MST reply actions  

New FanPost is up :

Phoenix Suns offseason plans ; tell me what you think???

by SunsASJD134 on Feb 4, 2012 11:23 PM MST reply actions  

Redd was very impressive

He is a proven scorer and he had a great game tonight. I think we should make him starter. Dudley is better off the bench, and Hill seems to be doing better when he plays less oddly. Chilly has been good too since he got into the rotation, but Brown, Frye and Morris were terrible. Frye is not fit to start on an NBA team, and Morris doesn’t want to, and Warrick won’t get the chance. I remember at the beginning of the year Warrick was our top scorer, while only playing 20 mpg. Frye, like Dudley is also better off the bench. I know people will disagree with this but I say start Warrick.

"I don't lift weights because they are heavy, and I don't run because it makes me tired." - Charles Barkley

by Suns R Us on Feb 5, 2012 1:04 AM MST reply actions  

The other way round makes more sense

The bench needs a scorer, and the starters need someone who can hit jumper – seeings as Frye and Hill can’t.

by MMotherwell on Feb 5, 2012 5:54 AM MST up reply actions  

I'm happy with the win but...

Sad bc i couldn’t stay in the thread

it was real slow, and it was not refreshing…so I had to leave

Love Redd play in this way. If he can keep it up we’ll be a little more dangerous

"Steve Nash is more valuable for the Suns than Kobe for the Lakers" - Jared Dudley

by Juac on Feb 5, 2012 1:05 AM MST reply actions  

Happy to see Redd play well.

A Suns win is just as good too. It puts a bounce in my step.

by Sunderstruck on Feb 5, 2012 2:58 AM MST reply actions  

Its a bit of a ray of sunshine actually

sententia Platonis semper in ore illius fuit, florere civitates si aut philosophi imperarent aut imperantes philosopharentur

by NASCARbernet on Feb 5, 2012 8:09 PM MST up reply actions  

Yeah Win is a win.But..

I’ve realized that some things tend to the end. We talked a lot that Suns are addicted to Nash.Gentry doesn’t know that?.He didn’t find other way to play. Most time of game Nash keep the ball and fact is, he creates shot position for yourself or other players. It’s nothing wrong. But Nash can stop play next year or maybe one year later. What next? No I don’t call to fire Nash I would say change the coach. In fourth quarter RoLo did some nice moves alone. It means he or MG can do that. C’s probably won’t be first scorer in this team however they should work this way. Give them a ball. Both worked with Olajuwan and I think they can create own shot. Coach have to find new way of play. Gentry still fight for couple of wins. He will not think about future. This my some thoughts. We won only by 6 points, it mean that Suns are as weak as Bobcats.

Why Gentry didn’t play RoLo i second quarter with Rockets? Time to change something.

by roby07 on Feb 5, 2012 3:09 AM MST reply actions  

Don’t discount the fact that the Suns played the night before in Houston (which isn’t exactly close) and were playing the fourth game in six days…

They played hard. They won. In this case, that’s all that matters.

Also, Redd showed up and played better as a starter. Gentry said after the game that with the older guys it’s harder coming off the bench than it is for them to warmup before the game or at the half and then play a long stretch. Hill does better starting then as a reserve. I suspect he’ll continue to try and start Redd…we’ll see.

And Robin earned his way back into the rotation by staying positive after getting benched and playing hard in his garbage time minutes. This team is much better when he’s playing well then when Warrick is getting those minutes.

Those were the two takeaways that could carry forward

Twitter me at: @sethpo

by Seth Pollack on Feb 5, 2012 8:28 AM MST up reply actions  

Yeah.Agrred.

I didn’t said that Lopez didn’t erned his minutes.I was suprised why gentry didn’t play him earlier in Houston.He put Warrick on court from Gortat. Why? I think you know (more or less) what I was trying to say. Gentry is also inconsistent.

by roby07 on Feb 5, 2012 9:16 AM MST up reply actions  

we may aswell stay positive and be happy about wins because untill nash retires or if we give him a chance at another team to get a ring which i dont think will happen i think hell retire here.
but untill the above happens where not gonna rebuild and we will remain middle of the run.
We prob also need to wait for a dumbass owner sarver to pass the team onto another owner whos actually interested in creating some success for this franchise not just turning over a profit.

Both of those things are still a few years away, so may aswell enjoy the wins and yes we will finish not good enough for playoffs and not bad enough for a good draft pick but ahwell. If steve wants to finish his career here we owe it to him to be patient and let him finish his career before we find some new to build around.

It just makes me laugh when i hear the franchise saying if they add a good FA at the end of this year theyll give nash one last chance. Were WAYYYYYYYY more than 1 good FA off competing in the west again. So if the franchise wants to honor nash and let him play his years here if he wants that then FO needs to understand where prob gonna suck for next few years

by bassy500 on Feb 5, 2012 3:16 AM MST reply actions  

Even Bassy has has his own fan base?

Who knew?

Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!

Read my thoughts on Creighton University athletics at Creightonian.com

I also edit things at Ridiculous Upside. Check it out.

by Omaha Sun on Feb 5, 2012 3:16 PM MST up reply actions  

If only the Suns Brass

Would read some of these threads. It’s not hard for them to understand what we want. We just want to win! With or without Nash, but preferably with. We just want to win period.

by SmokinKieff on Feb 5, 2012 4:06 AM MST via mobile reply actions  

Yes…I’m guessing Sarver doesn’t understand that fans want to win. It’s a tough concept.

Twitter me at: @sethpo

by Seth Pollack on Feb 5, 2012 8:29 AM MST up reply actions  

I'm guessing that Sarver doesn't care what fans want

sententia Platonis semper in ore illius fuit, florere civitates si aut philosophi imperarent aut imperantes philosopharentur

by NASCARbernet on Feb 5, 2012 9:11 AM MST up reply actions  

I hope everyone regrets the fact that we are not giving extensions to

Michael Redd
Ronnie Price
Robin Lopez

roses are red violets are blue, Michael Redd is coming for you!

by Lino Canaan on Feb 5, 2012 7:10 AM MST reply actions  

We can still extend them.

I hope we do – especially Redd and Lopez.

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
"In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip."

by haremoor on Feb 5, 2012 7:19 AM MST up reply actions  

We won´t i know my team...

roses are red violets are blue, Michael Redd is coming for you!

by Lino Canaan on Feb 5, 2012 7:20 AM MST up reply actions  

Okay, Eeyore.

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
"In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip."

by haremoor on Feb 5, 2012 7:34 AM MST up reply actions  

I don't think we can extend Frolo.

We missed that deadline. We can match whatever offer sheet he signs though as a RFA.

Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!

Read my thoughts on Creighton University athletics at Creightonian.com

I also edit things at Ridiculous Upside. Check it out.

by Omaha Sun on Feb 5, 2012 3:17 PM MST up reply actions  

yea those 3 are the only people id consider keep

redd would be a nice 12-15 pt 6th man 2 guard
Price would be our D minded PG just in case we cant sign anyone else.
Robin is 7’1 and had great value if we kept him to trade him later

"Clear eyes, full hearts, can't lose"

by phxpurple on Feb 5, 2012 2:58 PM MST up reply actions  

Redd and Lopez…eh maybe. Have to see what they do the rest of the season and what the price is. Price? No way. Next.

by BringBackBarkley17 on Feb 5, 2012 4:34 PM MST up reply actions  

The second team was exciting tonight - in a 2009-10 kind of way.

There was some serious gelling going on, and some very intense play. Very excited for, and about, Redd. It wouldn’t suck putting another all-star in our starting line-up, and moving Duds to a place that he can be even more effective, and Robin came out of the doghouse in style. It was good team basketball, and fun to watch.
I am as big a fan of Nash as anybody here, but he wasn’t on tonight. He missed Gortat going down the lane over and over, throwing it behind him. Even so, the team kept its head up, played like a team, and prevailed. And the 0-60 in .01 seconds from Grant was good to see. This team can win some games – hope it sticks around.

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
"In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip."

by haremoor on Feb 5, 2012 7:18 AM MST reply actions  

one thing i'm trying to understand right now is which "best case scenario" different interest groups are rooting for

for the “tank the season in hopes of improving draft status” contingent, the desired outcome is pretty clear – lose as many games as possible, because each loss (theoretically) brings us closer to a high draft pick

but what about the “play hard and win as many games as possible” group, of which i count myself as a member? do we believe that we can still make the playoffs? As of now, we’re in 12th place in the Western Conference, 4 games out of the 8-seed (which is currently occupied by Dallas, BTW). In terms of the “outside looking in” teams, Memphis, Houston, and Minnesota are all ahead of us. Those are all decent teams, and it’s hard for me to imagine overtaking them.

So again I return to my original question: if we’re rooting for the team to play hard and win, what’s the best outcome that we can hope for? Are we hoping to lose lots of games in valiant, never-say-die fashion, thus accomplishing the same end result hoped for by the “let’s suck” contingent, except without angering the basketball gods in the process?

If we miss the playoffs but manage to end the season looking like a semi-decent team, are we thinking that we can re-sign nash to a reasonable deal and then persuade a couple of star free agents to come play with him?

From a short-term, small picture standpoint, every win is great. But what is everyone’s sense of the long-term big-picture?

Just remember what ol' Jack Burton does when the earth quakes, and the poison arrows fall from the sky, and the pillars of Heaven shake. Yeah, Jack Burton just looks that big ol' storm right square in the eye and he says, "Give me your best shot, pal. I can take it."

~Jack Burton, "Big Trouble in Little China"

by u_must_chill on Feb 5, 2012 8:47 AM MST reply actions  

I've stopped looking beyond this season

Because of that very same dilemma.

If we win a game, awesome. I like watching us win.
If we lose a game, awesome. One loss closer to a great pick.

Win win for me.

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Feb 5, 2012 8:51 AM MST up reply actions  

Way to stay sanguine!

It was only called the mildly irritated house on McDowell until I showed up.

by Jim Coughenour on Feb 5, 2012 9:02 AM MST up reply actions  

i think that the great fear, oft-voiced by people on this website,

is that we are going to play just well enough to ruin our chances for a top pick.

thus, my desire to create a logically consistent framework for watching the remainder of this year’s suns games.

Just remember what ol' Jack Burton does when the earth quakes, and the poison arrows fall from the sky, and the pillars of Heaven shake. Yeah, Jack Burton just looks that big ol' storm right square in the eye and he says, "Give me your best shot, pal. I can take it."

~Jack Burton, "Big Trouble in Little China"

by u_must_chill on Feb 5, 2012 9:05 AM MST up reply actions  

lol

“logically consistent” is the exact opposite of “suns fan”

Blogging Suns Basketball at Bright Side of the Sun

by Alex Laugan on Feb 5, 2012 9:08 AM MST up reply actions  

I share that fear

But there’s really nothing that I can personally do to influence the moves the FO may make, so I’ve stopped worrying so much.

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Feb 5, 2012 9:53 AM MST up reply actions  

One FO move I'd like to see

is Sarver sell the Suns back to Jerry Colangelo.

sententia Platonis semper in ore illius fuit, florere civitates si aut philosophi imperarent aut imperantes philosopharentur

by NASCARbernet on Feb 5, 2012 10:17 AM MST up reply actions  

This picture may gain clarity over the next 2 weeks.

The Suns next 9 games include 7 teams with better records than the Suns and the other 2 (GS and Sacramento) are on the road. A 2-7 or 3-6 showing will basically shatter playoff hopes prior to the all-star break. After the break, 24 of the Suns 32 games are against teams with winning records (the Western Conference is brutal).

If the Suns can’t consistently bring improved play, the cheering interest for the playoff hopeful will disintegrate. If the Suns are 13-21, 6 games out of the playoffs, and in a dog fight for 12th place it will be interesting to see if and how the collective conscience shifts.

The “tanking” discussion is about degree of tanking in my opinion. It’s about how bad a team decides to blow it up in the rebuilding process. A team can’t create $30 million in cap space if they are fully invested in winning now. There’s definitely a dynamic of sacrificing short term success for the prospect of long term success already in play.

What we’re seeing now is that the Suns plan to remain competitive during the rebuilding process isn’t coming together as swimmingly as they would have hoped. I don’t see that as a catastrophe because I believe that the results of this season and the overall “future building” project can be discrete entities. Two years from now, I won’t be lambasting the front office for this season (if things continue to unravel) as long as they have better results at the rebuild.

Long term big picture (next year) -

Suns have possibility at retaining the best free agent point guard in the league (Nash)

Suns have 2 of their own young, talented draft picks on the roster (Morris, player X)

Suns sign multiple rotation/role players to make team more competitive next year

Suns maintain cap space to offer at least one max deal in summer of 2013

Suns have more assets to pursue trades next year than they have now

Something completely unexpected and wonderful happens (believe it or not, this has actually happened before – think Barkley, KJ, Nash, Amare, etc.)

It was only called the mildly irritated house on McDowell until I showed up.

by Jim Coughenour on Feb 5, 2012 9:36 AM MST up reply actions  

"Tanking"

is a product of a screwed up mindset. Yes, the idea that the worst team should get the best player may seem like a nice idea, but it’s like welfare – people get rewarded for not trying their best.

sententia Platonis semper in ore illius fuit, florere civitates si aut philosophi imperarent aut imperantes philosopharentur

by NASCARbernet on Feb 5, 2012 9:43 AM MST up reply actions  

I don't think so.

It just depends on how you look at it.

Sometimes good teams sacrifice their futures to win now. They are “tanking” their future.

Sometimes bad teams sacrifice their present to win in the future (the Suns right now). They are “tanking” their present.

It’s about severity. The faction that is against “tanking” is really against a losing mentality that pervades through an organization and undermines the ability to ascend from the morass. The allure of a high draft pick is enticing in concept, but this strategy is often meretricious and lacks the ability to translate well into practice. It is treacherous ground to tread upon. An organization that fosters a philosophy of intentional failure runs the risk of becoming too inveterated in the mindset.

It was only called the mildly irritated house on McDowell until I showed up.

by Jim Coughenour on Feb 5, 2012 10:57 AM MST up reply actions   1 recs

Rec’d for “meretricious” and a great post.

by BringBackBarkley17 on Feb 5, 2012 4:38 PM MST up reply actions  

I hope you mean 1 year deals

Suns sign multiple rotation/role players to make team more competitive next year

by SunsASJD134 on Feb 5, 2012 9:58 AM MST up reply actions  

First, let me clarify the rotation/role player statement.

This probably should have read starters/reserves.

1. The Suns could offer long term deals to players such as Batum, Wallace, Gordon, Beasley, Fields, etc. If the Suns really like a guy, they need to go get him. That’s the point of the cap space. The Suns free agent strategy needs to be the Nash principle. The borderline all-star that can blossom here in Phoenix. They aren’t getting an established star in his prime. Obviously the risk here is that the Suns overpay and the player ends up underperforming.

2. The Suns could go after one year deals such as Allen, Garnett, Camby, etc. This would work if there are no players the Suns want to commit long term money to, which might be the case since most of the best remaining free agents are restricted.

3. The Suns could add reserves such as Barbosa, Budinger, Turiaf, Belinelli, Dragic,etc. Here the Suns have leverage in terms of offering one year deals or front loaded contracts so they don’t get stuck in another Childress predicament.

1 is the biggest area of risk/reward. Judging from what’s left of this year’s free agent class I don’t think it looks promising.

2 & 3 should be areas where the Suns could be successful this offseason.

It was only called the mildly irritated house on McDowell until I showed up.

by Jim Coughenour on Feb 5, 2012 11:25 AM MST up reply actions  

well explained!

"Steve Nash is more valuable for the Suns than Kobe for the Lakers" - Jared Dudley

by Juac on Feb 5, 2012 1:47 PM MST up reply actions  

My view, FWIW...

I want to see the team get better. It’s much easier to keep what we have as opposed to FA signings and the draft. I know the grass is greener and all, but… If we’ve got Nash, Hill, Redd, Gortat, and Frye all playing well, individually and together as a team, that’s a pretty good team. If we have Dudley, Lopez, Morris, Chilly, Warrick, and both PG’s playing well individually and together, that’s a really good second team. With two trade chips. Add some cap room, and we could be really competitive.
I believe in options, and good options are better than bad options. We can’t control ping-pong balls, or what other teams do, we can only control what we do, and that should be trying as hard as we can, in all cases.

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
"In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip."

by haremoor on Feb 5, 2012 12:14 PM MST up reply actions  

Ahhh, I forgot Brown, who also has been playing pretty well.

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
"In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip."

by haremoor on Feb 5, 2012 12:21 PM MST up reply actions  

options are good. I’m waiting to hear the clear vision, and the ability to execute that vision. There are lots of ways to go. now the Suns need to pick one. They have no obligation to tell us anything before it actually happens, so I’m not expecting (or wanting) press conferences on it. I just hope it actually happens.

Blogging Suns Basketball at Bright Side of the Sun

by Alex Laugan on Feb 5, 2012 1:58 PM MST up reply actions  

This shows us

that if the Suns get great play from unexpected players like Michael Redd and Robin Lopez, they can beat teams mired in ten game losing streaks.

sententia Platonis semper in ore illius fuit, florere civitates si aut philosophi imperarent aut imperantes philosopharentur

by NASCARbernet on Feb 5, 2012 9:07 AM MST reply actions  

not to make excuses

But far too often it seems like we play the night before and fly home to a team thats been sitting in phx waiting on us a day or two.

skitsophrenics are never alone-Just ask scott howard

by stevedavis_ on Feb 5, 2012 1:31 PM MST up reply actions  

Historically

the Lakers always got some scheduling love.

sententia Platonis semper in ore illius fuit, florere civitates si aut philosophi imperarent aut imperantes philosopharentur

by NASCARbernet on Feb 5, 2012 8:10 PM MST up reply actions  

With all those guys injured, they are not a good team, clearly..

but we were on a back to back after a pretty bad loss, with no Dudley and with Frye still struggling, and with them rested and smarting off two horrible losses. And Themba Waljer looks like he can play as well as Williams, and Boris always torches us…. So ya, this still should have been a lot easier, but as many have said a W is a W.

One thing I have noticed over the last 5 games or so, is that we seemed to have a pretty big momentum loss when Lopez got ejected during the Raptors game. That coincided with the serious slide we took in that game, and that L led to another couple of key losses. I do think that suspension was a minor (small but noticeable) mini turning point in the season, because Lopez was providing some steady if unspectacular minutes for the last number of games. Bringing him in, has generally meant that we can give Gortat a few minutes rest with no serious consequence. And I think he has been doing a good job of that for much of the season. I was dissapointed to see that he was so much in Gentry’s dog house, since the ejection, and that the ejection meant that effectively he was out for 5 games.

Hopefully tonight’s perfermance wins him a few more mins.

by HarvMel on Feb 5, 2012 9:18 AM MST reply actions  

I was kind of mad

the fact rthat the bobcats are 3-21 , the worst team in the league, 11 game losing streak, AND WE WERE PLAYING AT HOME, AND THEY DIDNT HAVE THEIR 3 LEADING SCORERS, yet we still managed to almost let this game slip…

by SunsASJD134 on Feb 5, 2012 9:42 AM MST reply actions  

Thank goodness

we had Robin Lopez and Michael Redd there to save us…

sententia Platonis semper in ore illius fuit, florere civitates si aut philosophi imperarent aut imperantes philosopharentur

by NASCARbernet on Feb 5, 2012 9:44 AM MST up reply actions  

HAHA listen to this,

2 years ago, if you woulda told me
- we were gonna be in an uphill battle with the bobcats at home
- Michael Redd would be our leading scorer
- Robin Lopez would win the game for us in the 4th
- and charlotte was missing their 3 best players

I WOULD KICKED YOU IN THE NUTS!!!

by SunsASJD134 on Feb 5, 2012 9:53 AM MST reply actions  

Then good thing i didnt know you 2 years ago

No longer trying to light Vince Carter on fire.

by Scott Howard on Feb 5, 2012 2:29 PM MST via mobile up reply actions   2 recs

Does any of the other older bright siders remember

this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAFSM1zcaPU It was on a super bowl sunday 1990 I believe.

skitsophrenics are never alone-Just ask scott howard

by stevedavis_ on Feb 5, 2012 11:22 AM MST reply actions   2 recs

That was beautiful!

Rec.

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
"In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip."

by haremoor on Feb 5, 2012 12:18 PM MST up reply actions  

That was the first February of my life so I don't remember it

But I have seen the clip many, many times since.

TC FTW

Steve Nash, the league's MVP, is a longhaired Canadian who spoke out against the war in Iraq and reads The Communist Manifesto. Quentin Richardson declared after a game-winning shot that it "was like Hamlet. It was a suspense thriller, and I killed them at the end." Amare Stoudemire, when asked to comment on a 22-point third quarter against the Kings, said, "I've got a tendency to jump over some guys' heads and throw it down."

by rsavaj on Feb 5, 2012 12:29 PM MST up reply actions  

thats how much

things have changed,it was actualy in january back then,and if anyone was wondering there was no comeback we lost to the original big 3!

skitsophrenics are never alone-Just ask scott howard

by stevedavis_ on Feb 5, 2012 1:25 PM MST up reply actions  

Thanks for that.

I really enjoyed those KJ/Chambers/Hornacek teams, pre-Barkley. That team would have driven the “championship or bust!” people nuts because they weren’t winning a title and I think everybody knew that. But they would win 50 games and be entertaining as hell.

Blogging Suns basketball for Bright Side of the Sun from California wine country.
Twitter: @EastBayRaymundo

by East Bay Ray on Feb 5, 2012 1:33 PM MST up reply actions  

kinda like the 70s and 2000s Suns…

Blogging Suns Basketball at Bright Side of the Sun

by Alex Laugan on Feb 5, 2012 2:00 PM MST up reply actions  

Or the 2004-2010 Suns

"I don't lift weights because they are heavy, and I don't run because it makes me tired." - Charles Barkley

by Suns R Us on Feb 5, 2012 4:14 PM MST up reply actions  

yeah that’s what meant by 2000s. Agreed.

Blogging Suns Basketball at Bright Side of the Sun

by Alex Laugan on Feb 5, 2012 8:44 PM MST up reply actions  

I thought you might have been talking about the 50 win Cliff Robinson, Jason Kidd, Penny Hardaway years.

"I don't lift weights because they are heavy, and I don't run because it makes me tired." - Charles Barkley

by Suns R Us on Feb 5, 2012 9:17 PM MST up reply actions  

I remember the Celtics seemingly being unbeatable at the Garden.

I hated it when the Suns played there.

Bird’s first 9 years they were 321-48 at home.

It was only called the mildly irritated house on McDowell until I showed up.

by Jim Coughenour on Feb 5, 2012 3:29 PM MST up reply actions  

If we continue to start Redd, then someone has to have their minutes cut down

It’s either Brown, Dudley, Childress, Price, Frye or Hill. I think we need to trade Price and Brown, or Frye if he keeps it up, and cut Hill’s minutes a little, so we end up with;
C – Gortat, Lopez
PF – Warrick, Morris
SF – Hill, Childress
SG – Redd, Dudley
PG – Nash, Telfair,
I think part of Gentry’s problem is he plays too many players, this is a solution to that. I know that doesn’t add up to 12 players, but I don’t know who to keep that would keep the rotation small, Price you could keep and play around 10 min, but it’s not worth it to pay Frye to MLE to play 15 min and shoot 30 %.

"I don't lift weights because they are heavy, and I don't run because it makes me tired." - Charles Barkley

by Suns R Us on Feb 5, 2012 4:31 PM MST reply actions  

We have threads for rosterbation...

Not in victory threads, please.

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
"In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip."

by haremoor on Feb 5, 2012 6:52 PM MST up reply actions  

It's not rosterbation, it's rotationbation.

I didn’t suggest any players to get, I suggested getting rid of some and balancing the rotation.

"I don't lift weights because they are heavy, and I don't run because it makes me tired." - Charles Barkley

by Suns R Us on Feb 5, 2012 7:56 PM MST up reply actions  

Addition by subtraction

Doesn’t rosterbation involve trades where we get players in return, I was suggesting just trading these players for anything so we can balance the rotation.

"I don't lift weights because they are heavy, and I don't run because it makes me tired." - Charles Barkley

by Suns R Us on Feb 5, 2012 8:30 PM MST up reply actions  

Rosterbation is indulging yourself by toying with the roster and imagining what the team could be if you were the GM.

That can involve trades, FA signings, or rotation changes.

If a rotation change or FA signing has something to do with the game the thread is celebrating (say Michael Redd), then it is permissible.

Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!

Read my thoughts on Creighton University athletics at Creightonian.com

I also edit things at Ridiculous Upside. Check it out.

by Omaha Sun on Feb 5, 2012 10:58 PM MST up reply actions  

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