Suns thinking of trading Amare in off season?....

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 1:27 AM MDT

I really love Amare's explosive dunks, and he's improving in rebounding, etc. But, it's clear (in my opinion) he wants to be the center of the suns, or wherever he goes. Call it the Kobe complex, or Joe Johnson complex, etc but I think Amare has it. Consider Marion, who when asked to guard Parker and forget about offense, shuts Parker down because he didn't have to spend time helping on Duncan (important to mention, it's really a ? as to how bad parker hurt his arm during the barbosa fall, makes game 3 even more interesting than it already will be) and he scored 5 points (only took 4 shots and made 2)!!! To me, yes maybe Marion doesn't agree with not scoring more, but he does it. What Marion will do in the name of the team is really pretty awesome.

I love this team, so it's hard for me to think about this, but I also think most of this team is very 'TEAM' oriented, where Amare is not. Plus, he's not the brightest apple, I can't keep up with his comments that ring of selfish views. He has said Kobe should be the mvp, is Kobe the most talented offensive player, yes, will he make his teammates better, no, not like Nash. Amare, I love watching you play, but, I'd rather lose you than Marion, or anyone else. Just think of the trade possibilities, besides 2 or 3 players, just about anyone is a possibility. Just putting this out here because of the hoopsworld article,

One last comment, do I think this team (Suns) can win it all this year, yes, I really do. I believe in them and even though I live in Texas, I'm a diehard Suns fan and will not abandon the ship, because for the last 2-3 years, it's been the best sports ride I've ever been a fan of!

Poll

If you had to trade 1 Sun, who would it be?

Steve Nash

0 votes

Amare

6 votes

Marion

6 votes

Barbosa

0 votes

The Gorilla (don't do it, he's cool)

0 votes

12 votes | Poll has closed

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Comments

No comment...

Nice find, but I don't even want to comment on this stuff.... I guess I am anyways. First of all, it's just a rumor so who knows what Amare wants.... a week ago it was Marion so now it's him. I wouldn't be surprised if they say Nash wants to quit basketball and play pro soccer alongside Beckham in L.A. at the end of the year. Maybe Amare does want a lot of attention and wants to be the man, but that doesn't mean he wants out or that D'Antoni wants him gone. If they don't win everything this year, I guess somebody's leaving though.

I will say that I find it so irritating that these multi millionaire athletes who play sports for a living (they "play" for a living), are mobbed by fans, get their own shoe made for them, commercial deals, billboards, endorsements, clothing, nicknames, mansions, cars, agents, entourages, and on and on and on... why don't they just want to win? Just be a part of a team that can win it all and do their part and be satisfied that they are on a winning team in the NBA.

I don't want to see anybody go but if they don't want to be here then... out the door with you. Just remember to watch us on TV next season during the playoffs... from your living room... with Joe Johnson.

by Trvs on May 10, 2007 2:22 AM MDT reply actions

yep

that's part of why college basketball seems like more fun, everyone there is struggling to win and get noticed, they're not all rich, etc

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 10:21 AM MDT up reply actions

Call Jordan

I think the Suns should be doing business with the Bobcats. I don't think we should trade Amare, but if we have to (damn tax) then, I think, Amare for Okafor and the Bobcats' No.1 in 08 would be at least tolerable. The Bobcats are so far under the cap that it wouldn't even matter that their salaries don't match, so the Suns could actually cut their cap number by about 7-8 mil, and the 08 pick with this year's 2 or 3 picks could at least help us get younger and perhaps find a Nash successor and a new interior finisher.

by rosewood on May 10, 2007 8:14 AM MDT reply actions

Don't trade Amare

Amare-

He is a handful, egotistical but he is good for the team. He is not mature enough to be the leader of this team, but he is a great contributor who always delivers on his promises.

I like Shawn a lot, but he makes a lot of money and if the money could be used to bring in a younger player who could make great impact in a year or two, it may be worth it. This year I have been a little disappointed in the way Shawn conducted himself, but he is a great player for the Suns. The only reason I would trade him is money.

I would not trade Steve at all. We have seen what happens to the team when he is not around. We have to start looking for his possible replacement when he is ready to retire- may be in 3 years?

by Vash01 @ Bright Side Of The Sun on May 10, 2007 8:32 AM MDT up reply actions

I just don't see it

Notice the "rumor mill" just says that they've heard it a few times. Big deal. Now we've heard it again from the "rumor mill". So one person says something, then someone else picks up on it and says, "I heard about this rumor." Someone else picks it up again and repeats it and then the Rumor Mill says, "I didn't believe it the first time but now I have heard it a few times."

I never believe these rumors. I would bet an awful lot that the Suns don't trade Amare. If anything, they'll trade Marion because he wants to be traded.

by Dan @ Bright Side Of The Sun on May 10, 2007 8:44 AM MDT reply actions

Does he?

Now you're starting rumors. :) I haven't heard that Marion wants to be traded (though it wouldn't surprise me). Have you actually read/heard that somewhere, or just speculating because of some of the "woe is me" stuff he says to the media sometimes?

by TexSUN on May 10, 2007 9:12 AM MDT up reply actions

Just starting more rumors

But it is the general consensus around the Valley that it was Marion that Steve Nash was talking about and I think it showed in how he played game 2. If the Suns are going to win a championship, it's going to be with Shawn Marion playing as hard as he can. But it wouldn't surprise me to see a trade demand after the season. He's obviously got "Joe-Johnson-itis" and wants to be the big fish in a little pond rather than stay with a successful team and be the third wheel.

But can you blame him? How many of us would give up our nice, comfortable jobs where we know we're doing a good job and won't get fired if we were offered to go be the CEO or General Manager at a different company?

by Dan @ Bright Side Of The Sun on May 10, 2007 11:54 AM MDT up reply actions

Uh, yes..

I can blame him. Your analogy doesn't work. I'd take third in command at a nice, championship-contending company any day over being CEO of some mom-and-pop that's just fighting to stay in business. More to the point, he's a basketball player, and it's supposed to be about doing whatever he can to help his team win, not about gaining individual glory for himself. Marion is one of my favorite players in the league, but when he starts with this "poor me I never get noticed" BS, it makes me want to have a reaction similar to what Bill Simmons did: ARGH!! YOU BONEHEAD!!! I know there's something to be said for a guy who's just trying to do what's best financially for himself and his family, but really, don't you think Marion would be a lot more marketable if he didn't come across as some pathetic, whiney superstar-"wannabe"? (Yeah, you caught me in one of "those moods" again...count me among those who don't like discussing trades and the like while the team hasn't even been booted from the playoffs yet).

by TexSUN on May 10, 2007 12:10 PM MDT up reply actions

playoffs....timing

Your right, it is bad timing to talk about this, it was more of me looking into the teams chemistry and seeing how different players act. Like when Nash was calling out his team to play harder, I didn't realize his main focus was Marion. Also, with Nash it's so easy to like him on and off the court, the same can be said for bell, barbosa, K.Thomas, etc but not for Marion and Amare. The only reason I put Marion in there is because he thinks he should've been the defensive player of the year. On an interview after a laker game with Amare and Marion, I heard Marion say something to the effect...that him not winning the dpoy award was bullshit. I just find it very funny that Nash could care less about the mvp vs Marion and Amare and Kobe and what they care about, personal accolades. Would we be able to beat the spurs w/o Amare, almost for sure not, but, my point is the chemistry of this team isn't 100% like it might have been. You have 2 players that are genuine superstars, that have motive issues and don't play consistently on the effort side.

Forget the trade rumor, I wanted to discuss Amare and Marion, and how they fit onto this team.

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 1:12 PM MDT up reply actions

texsun, dan..

I've heard all over the radio here that Nash was mostly referring to Marion after game 1 with the "lack of effort and energy" comment. That's it's no secret in Phoenix that, that is who Nash was talking about. I know Nash was classy, and said "we", and tried to include himself in his comment...

Thought that was interesting....

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 10:27 AM MDT up reply actions

Amare, Nash, and Wally Pipp

If Amare really is unhappy, I'm thinking it's because he thought the Suns were going to still be "his team" when he helped convince Steve to sign with them. He probably thought (as did I), that Steve was coming in to fill a role similar to what he had in Dallas, only with a tad more responsibility because it was a young team. But I don't think he, or anybody else, expected it would outright become "Steve's team", or that the league would start to see facilitators as MVP's because of Steve's impact. Amare must feel a little like he's been Wally Pipp'ed, by a guy he helped bring to the Suns in the first place. But he still has a lot to learn about being a leader before I'd consider it a good idea to give him his team back. I really hope he can look at the years between now and whenever Steve is no longer able to fill that role (via age, retirement, or otherwise) as a golden opportunity to learn how to lead a team from one of the best--and maybe win a championship or few along the way.

by TexSUN on May 10, 2007 9:22 AM MDT reply actions

nice point ..

Your 100% right, I'm sure Amare didn't foresee Nash becoming what he has for us. I did notice something on Amare vs K.Thomas on defense on Duncan. It's no secret K.Thomas does a better job on Duncan, and I think K.Thomas had to become that defensive player to get playing time years ago.

Where Amare is such an offensive juggernaut that his defense skills are still being developed. You can tell it bothers Amare that K.Thomas could do what he couldn't, I doubt if Amare has even fully admitted this. When Duncan was asked about the difference, he said they were totally different, that Amare relies on his athleticism while Kurt relies on strength and positioning, strategy, etc. I've noticed K.Thomas plays defense with his legs and body, Amare just tries to block at the last minute or swipe (he plays defense with his hands more). Amare needs to go to K.Thomas camp and learn, problem is, Amare feels he's better than K.Thomas, just like he feels he's better than Nash and won't get this help (just my guess there, hope I'm wrong). That's the beauty of Nash, he doesn't act like he's above anyone, he's a team player, and it's the "team" idea that make the Suns so much fun. Amare's main focus is to become the best player, there's a chemistry to this team that demands unselfishness.

I hope I'm wrong about Amare, I hope he works with
this team. On it's just a rumor comment, yeah, your right, but parts or all of rumor is sometimes based on part or all of what's going on.

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 10:41 AM MDT up reply actions

I disagree

I don't think Kurt Thomas bothers Amare at all. In fact, when he found out that Thomas was going to start, he was so excited he blurted it out to the media. He has been pushing for Thomas to start all year and wants to play more with him. Amare does not want to play center and feels that he can be more successful at the power forward spot instead of at the center. With KT playing center, it allows him to do what he wants to do.

And so far, it's been successful.

by Dan @ Bright Side Of The Sun on May 10, 2007 11:57 AM MDT up reply actions

Exactly

Amare doesn't want to have to cover Duncan. He talked about how "stars don't guard eachother".

He is also a much better help defender where he can leap and make blocks or use his quickness to help w/ guards penetration.

I have been very impressed w/ Amare this year. He talks about his focus being defense and rebounding and he is fine not getting as many touches or have the ball go through him more. That could change but so far so good and I think he will only get more mature as he ages. He's so young still.

Btw, The Suns aren't trading Amare. Not going to happen. Marion maybe but it would have to be a great deal and b/c of contract I don't see who would be able to take him anyway.

Diaw I think will be gone and Banks of course. That's about it. Diaw btw, I am starting to appreciate more and more. I am going post on him soon.

by Seth Pollack on May 10, 2007 12:45 PM MDT up reply actions

Diaw

Diaw just infuriates me because he could be the best player on the team if he wanted to be. He's got the whole package: footwork, post moves, passing skills, unselfishness, and can even shoot a LOT better than he could pre-Suns (when he just puts it up without debating with himself first, it almost always goes in). I'm not sure whether he's just having trouble figuring out where to fit in with Amare and Nash on the floor, or if he's just lazy. If it's the former, then shame in Mike D'Antoni for not finding a way to help Diaw find his place on the team this year. If it's the latter, then sadly, he's probably hopeless. It's really too bad. If there's anybody on the team that could carry the Suns as far as playmaking goes once Nash retires, it's Diaw. But the guess from here is that he won't ever get (or even earn) that chance.

by TexSUN on May 10, 2007 12:58 PM MDT up reply actions

It's sad but if..

Diaw had the passion that his 2 friends show so much of (Turiaf and Parker) Diaw would be great. Your right, it's very disappointing. I wonder what it is that has lead up to these poor results? He has had some great moments.

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 1:20 PM MDT up reply actions

your right...my point is

K.Thomas is a much better defender than Amare, and yet Amare has 5 times the physical attributes, just pointing that out. On an interview with Amare about K.Thomas guarding Duncan so well, Amare made the point of bringing up Duncan's superstar level and how respected he was (I'm reading between the lines, but it sounds like he's saying Duncan gets all the calls because of who he is). I'll agree there have been a 3-4 horrible calls, but I think the Amare foul trouble isn't so much respect, but he doesn't play defense like K.Thomas. Obviously freeing up Amare and having him and Marion in their new positions is a great thing.

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 1:17 PM MDT up reply actions

Defense takes time

In the NBA you rarely see young guys be great defenders. I think it takes time to learn how to play defense and there multiple types of defense.

Amare has taken HUGE steps forward this year in his help defense (see my post about his work on stopping Parker) and rebounding.

Getting better 1:1 in the post against a guy as good as Duncan is going to take more time. Its as much about smarts and game IQ and position while his help defense is more about his superior skills.

Amare is only in his 4th year (3rd really) and will get a lot better on that end of the floor if he wants to - and he seems to want that. I think he knows that in a few years (5?) when Nash is gone he will be this team's Duncan. An unstoppable stud on both ends of the floor.

by Seth Pollack on May 10, 2007 1:24 PM MDT up reply actions

your right

Good point about defenders and age, I'm not looking ahead yet, we have a championship team to beat....but I have watched the other games and I think Utah is playing very well. Kirilenko, Andrei is playing hard, and their guard Deron Williams, wow, this guy is really great for being so young. I think whomever wins here will have the edge in the next series, but I don't think it'll be sweep time or anything. Both Utah and G.S. are playing very well. Great playoffs, nice to hear Fisher's 1yr old's operation was deemed successful.

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 1:34 PM MDT up reply actions

That was a fun game to watch...

I have been very impressed w/ Utah's ability to win close games. GSW dirked that one last night though. Missing all those free throws late? Not good.

I think if GSW can lock down their transition defense and stop the easy points the Jazz are getting they would be up in this series.

Fun stuff expect for that scary Dee Brown injury. Once I saw the replay I thought that guy might have a broken neck! Did you see him on the stretcher? He locked really f-d up. I read though that its just a neck sprain and he's traveling w/ the team to Oakland for game 3. Great to hear.

Fisher story was cool too. Great game.

by Seth Pollack on May 10, 2007 1:50 PM MDT up reply actions

yep

we need to copyright the word "dirked" , I can't stop laughing after how you used it. I must find a way to use it tonight with my wife and kids. Possible examples...I blow off mowing the lawn, my wife says I dirked the job,

I dirk (run) my car into the mailbox

it's endless,

by jasonsuns1 on May 10, 2007 2:00 PM MDT up reply actions

LOL

You beat me to it, jasonsuns1! I was just wondering whether "dirked" will be one of those words of the year. Poor guy.

by TexSUN on May 10, 2007 2:06 PM MDT up reply actions

I love it!

No disrespect to Mr.Nowitzki, but I love the way 'dirked' it was used, in such a fluid manner. I hope Dirk has the sense of humor to appreciate it.

by Vash01 @ Bright Side Of The Sun on May 10, 2007 10:48 PM MDT reply actions

More on the "Trade Amare" rumor

I hesitate to post this. But since we already have a thread for it, here goes...

A Mavs fan sent me a link to a thread on a Mavericks bulletin board on which a supposed writer for HoopsWorld claims to have gotten the information about Amare being traded straight from Mike D'Antoni himself. See posts by "Bill Ingram", the most relevant of which is this:

This is straight from their GM, who made us wait a couple of weeks to make it public. D'Antoni thought the team was better last season without Amare and "Stud-a-mire" wants to be "The Man," which he isn't in Phoenix.

There's some talk that he could be the piece that gets KG out of Minny, as he's one of the few players who would keep Wolves fans from revolting at the departure of their only decent player.

Personally, the Mavs could do a lot worse than sending Dirk to play with Nash and bringing Amare here. Of course, Phoenix would be crazy to hand the Mavs Amare.

So no idea if the guy is full of it (probably), or if this is something that actually happened. Even if it did actually happen, who knows, maybe D'Antoni was just sending a message to Amare that "me first" won't be tolerated, and that if he insists on being Joe Johnson, he can go somewhere else to do it. Again, I wasn't sure if I should even post this, but anyway, here it is for what its worth. Now, let's just set it aside and worry about beating SA. :)

by TexSUN on May 11, 2007 7:40 PM MDT reply actions

Enough already about trades.....

can we save all that when we are in the offseason? Who stays and who goes doesn't really matter now. Nash will keep everything together, and all will be well in Suns land. I know its just a topic to talk about while we wait for the game tommorrow, but lets focus on the positive and not things we cannot control.

P.S. Love the "dirked" comment.....

Lets go Suns.

by USMCGUNZ on May 11, 2007 7:45 PM MDT reply actions

Agreed.

Sorry for violating my own rule. But I was just as curious as anyone else to find out where a rumor that crazy came from. Like I said, no reason to be certain it's true, that's just info that was passed to me so I was just passing it along. But you're right; it's way off topic.

by TexSUN on May 11, 2007 7:49 PM MDT up reply actions